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2 Trains collide head-on in Greece. Multiple Deceased, Dozens Injured, Death Toll Expected to Rise.

Aggelos

Aggelos

Member
2 Trains collide near Larissa, Greece, at least 36 killed, dozens injured.

Edit:
"With at least 57 fatalities, more than 85 injured and 2 still missing, it is the worst disaster in the history of railways in Greece."

en.wikipedia.org

Tempi train crash - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
























www.reuters.com

Greece train crash kills at least 36, injures scores

A Greek passenger train collided head-on with a cargo train late on Tuesday, throwing entire carriages off the tracks and killing at least 36 people, many of them students, in the country's deadliest rail crash in living memory.
www.reuters.com www.reuters.com

www.ekathimerini.com

Trains collide near Larissa, at least 36 killed, dozens injured | eKathimerini.com

A passenger train and a cargo train collided head-on in Greece on Tuesday night, killing at least 36 people and injuring dozens as the country’s deadliest rail crash in living memory threw entire carriages off the tracks.
www.ekathimerini.com www.ekathimerini.com
 
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Aggelos

Aggelos

Member
SlimySnake said:
How does this even happen? Dont they have the separate tracks for inbound and outbound trains?
Click to expand...

There are two 2 different tracks in the Greek railway system, but it seems that a human error has in fact contributed to this tragedy.
The 60-year-old station master was put in this job a month ago after having one-month training. First, he stated that it was a system failure, but the latest reports mention that he confessed to his error (i.e. sending the passenger train to the track where the cargo train was traveling in the opposite direction).
The result? Head-on collision of two trains and an unspeakable tragedy.
 
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SlimySnake

SlimySnake

The Contrarian
Aggelos said:
There are two 2 different tracks in the Greek railway system, but it seems that a human error has in fact contributed to this tragedy.
The 60-year-old station master was put in this job a month ago after having one-month training. First, he stated that it was a system failure, but the latest reports mention that he confessed to his error (i.e. sending the passenger train to the track where the cargo train was traveling in the opposite direction).
The result? Head-on collision of two trains and an unspeakable tragedy.
Click to expand...
Thats awful. Are there no safeguards? Sounds like that Breaking Bad plot.

I dont feel safe traveling by trains now.
 
RiccochetJ

RiccochetJ

Member
DeepEnigma said:
Damn, RIP.

And WTF is up with all the train issues around the world recently?
Click to expand...
Well if you're talking about how everyone is reporting on derailments recently, it's because people have a magnifying glass on trains due to what happened in Ohio, people are freaking out, it's good clickbait, and it gives politicians the ability to grandstand.
According to federal data, more than 1000 derailments happen each year on average in the US:
www.poynter.org

We’ve seen reports of three train derailments this month. Is this normal? - Poynter

Federal data shows more than 1,000 train derailments happen each year on average. Most do not cause extensive damage or result in injuries or death.
www.poynter.org www.poynter.org

What's uncommon is how much damage they do. The Ohio one was significant due to the toxic chemicals and now unfortunately this one which appears to be due to human error and caused significant loss of life.
 
BlackTron

BlackTron

Member
GymWolf said:
How the fuck can this happen with all the radio communication and stuff?

Rip.
Click to expand...

It seems all the electronic systems and safeguards in their rail system have been busted for years, and everything is done manually. So, it was very prone to human error.

Not saying the station master didn't drop the ball (he did fail, and hard) but they were also asking for this to happen by neglecting to maintain the system.
 
GymWolf

GymWolf

Member
BlackTron said:
It seems all the electronic systems and safeguards in their rail system have been busted for years, and everything is done manually. So, it was very prone to human error.

Not saying the station master didn't drop the ball (he did fail, and hard) but they were also asking for this to happen by neglecting to maintain the system.
Click to expand...
Disgusting, every dude who was in charge of these decision should be thrown in jail.

How can you neglect stuff like that?


This fucking planet...
 
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newtypepilot

newtypepilot

Member
RIP to all the victims.

wtf, there should be multiple safeguards in place as systems like track signals and train control would prevent this from happening, even if the station master had sent the train to the wrong track. Like, there had to be multiple points of failure, or they were running things manually which is even more bonkers.
 
BlackTron

BlackTron

Member
GymWolf said:
Disgusting, every dude who was in charge of these decision should be thrown in jail.

How can you neglect stuff like that?


This fucking planet...
Click to expand...

Don't count on it. I'm sure it was a funding issue. I can't read Greek but I hear the rail people even protested about it. As if the government people that make funding decisions would face any consequences.

Aside from the fact that they already ruined Greece's economy and are skating by on bailouts.
 
Aggelos

Aggelos

Member
The chief coroner of the Larissa Medical Examiner's Office reports that they have completed the autopsy and medical examination of 43 decedents and they're, in fact, in really bad shape. (mostly ages between 20-30 years old, from what the chief coroner can gather)
In order to be identified, DNA samples have to be taken from the decedents and all their relatives. Pictures are also taken in case there's anything from their belongings that can be used to identify them.
In addition, the chief coroner reports that they have mutilated limbs and body parts that need to be identified.











 
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BlackTron

BlackTron

Member
newtypepilot said:
RIP to all the victims.

wtf, there should be multiple safeguards in place as systems like track signals and train control would prevent this from happening, even if the station master had sent the train to the wrong track. Like, there had to be multiple points of failure, or they were running things manually which is even more bonkers.
Click to expand...

They have those systems. They just didn't work for years and funding never got approved to fix it. So, oh well.
 
AlteredForms

AlteredForms

Member
RIP. Greece was hurting due to a recession right or was that years ago? Hope the country can jump back from this. Also, I want to try those moustokoloura grape cookies one day.
 
FeralEcho

FeralEcho

Member
GymWolf said:
Disgusting, every dude who was in charge of these decision should be thrown in jail.

How can you neglect stuff like that?


This fucking planet...
Click to expand...
It's all about greed,upping the profit,lowering cost without the thought of endangering people until a disaster happens then everyone in charge is like
sorry tony hayward GIF by South Park


It happens time and time again,it happened recently in Turkey as well with the earthquake and the way all those buildings werent earthquake proof because of corruption.

This world is a shitshow of narcissistic greedy cunts.
 
xrnzaaas

xrnzaaas

Member
Damn if they actually were running everything manually then a big crash like this was bound to happen sooner and later. You can't just ignore repairing all of the electronical safeguards and assume that there will be no human errors.
 
Aggelos

Aggelos

Member
bitbydeath said:
Seems wrong to blame everything on the brand new station master.
Click to expand...

True. It seems like other factors have contributed also, aside from human error.

Vassilis Zavogiannis, the person representing the workers of Hellenic Train SA on the board of the company that operates the country’s passenger and freight trains, spoke of a system that had been “disarmed.”
“The fundamental problem on this particular line, between Athens and Thessaloniki, is that the remote-controlled operation and signaling systems – that is the basic safety measures that protect trains from accidents – do not work,” Zavogiannis said. “Essentially, on a line that is critical for the country, the part of safety and protection relies, in the year 2023, entirely on the human factor. Our trains operate like they did 30 years ago. To put it metaphorically, it’s like having a pothole in front of our house: We know where it is and we avoid it, but at some point we will fall into it. That’s what happened here,” he added. “Just imagine that it took 45 whole minutes to locate which part of the route the train was at. It’s shocking,” he said.






 
E

El Pistolero

Member
Words are failing me right now...You embark on a train with all the thoughts of the world, except for that one where you envisage your life tragically ending because of underfunding and inadequate training around an incredibly sensitive position.
R.I.P to the victims, and may the injured ones fully recover, physically and psychologically.
 
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German Hops

German Hops

Member
It's baffling how long the fail safes were ignored, but hopefully this issue gets resolved definitely.
Unfortunately, it has come at the cost of so many lives. :messenger_crying:
 
Aggelos

Aggelos

Member
The chief coroner of the Larissa Medical Examiner's Office reported that the death toll had risen to 57 fatalities.
Allegedly, the human error may have only been the tip of the iceberg, in a barrage of omissions and failures involving: budget cuts within Hellenic Trains SA, understaffing, safety systems that haven't been working, a railway system that is not properly maintained/serviced, etc that played their role in this disaster.







 
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StreetsofBeige

StreetsofBeige

Member
I dont know anything about trains, but skimming the posts it seems like a combo of a new driver and archaic safety controls and infrastructure.

Even though Greece seems like a broke country (bail outs needed and some reason hiring too many government workers), you got to put money into infrastructure and safety policies. You can always tell which countries do and dont. As per Agellos' post above, if a country cant fix train lines in 30 years, there's issues where money is being spent.

The ones that dont always have collapsing buildings, broken bridges, fires that can sweep across entire neighbourhoods, ferries overloading and sinking etc..
 
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EverydayBeast

EverydayBeast

thinks Halo Infinite is a new graphical benchmark
Trains are worth a lot they began using them in the 1900s one of the greatest methods of transportation we’ve ever seen, yet we get these rare deadly crashes.
 
Kenpachii

Kenpachii

Member
StreetsofBeige said:
I dont know anything about trains, but skimming the posts it seems like a combo of a new driver and archaic safety controls and infrastructure.

Even though Greece seems like a broke country (bail outs needed and some reason hiring too many government workers), you got to put money into infrastructure and safety policies. You can always tell which countries do and dont. As per Agellos' post above, if a country cant fix train lines in 30 years, there's issues where money is being spent.

The ones that dont always have collapsing buildings, broken bridges, fires that can sweep across entire neighbourhoods, ferries overloading and sinking etc..
Click to expand...

Knew a greek guy, he told me most people just ride those trains for free and can't be bothered to even pay. If its true that could be the issue right there.
 
TGO

TGO

Hype Train conductor. Works harder than it steams.
I have no words, this should have NEVER happened.
The amount of safe guards, location tracking etc that is and has been available for decades and this still happened.
R.I.P
 
Tams

Tams

Member
Kenpachii said:
Knew a greek guy, he told me most people just ride those trains for free and can't be bothered to even pay. If its true that could be the issue right there.
Click to expand...
Very much this. Greece has some serious and deep social issues that make other countries' look like nothing.

There's a deeply ingrained stinginess and entitlement. They want public services but aren't prepared to pay for them. I don't know how or why it came to be, but it has.

Of course, that's not all Greeks. But it is a very significant number of them.
 
Aggelos

Aggelos

Member
Actually now they have 56 people unaccounted-for and the confirmed fatalities are 57. This implies that there is a possibility that some people on the train were in fact "fare dodgers".
But this is still under investigation, nothing official as of yet, about (the) potential ticket dodgers on board.









 
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Vestal

Vestal

Junior Member
How in the year 2023 don't we have a complete digital map of the railway along with GPS location & direction for each train on it. Computer simulations would alert to and/or prevent collisions.
Its not rocket science.
 
Hugare

Hugare

Member
Aggelos said:
There are two 2 different tracks in the Greek railway system, but it seems that a human error has in fact contributed to this tragedy.
The 60-year-old station master was put in this job a month ago after having one-month training. First, he stated that it was a system failure, but the latest reports mention that he confessed to his error (i.e. sending the passenger train to the track where the cargo train was traveling in the opposite direction).
The result? Head-on collision of two trains and an unspeakable tragedy.
Click to expand...
Poor guy

Imagine his guilt for being responsible for so many deaths, ruining families, the resignation of the transport minister, the worst train accident on the history of the country and etc.
 
Tams

Tams

Member
Vestal said:
How in the year 2023 don't we have a complete digital map of the railway along with GPS location & direction for each train on it. Computer simulations would alert to and/or prevent collisions.
Its not rocket science.
Click to expand...

1. Underfund the railway.
2. Have a massive tragedy.
 
Aggelos

Aggelos

Member
Vestal said:
How in the year 2023 don't we have a complete digital map of the railway along with GPS location & direction for each train on it. Computer simulations would alert to and/or prevent collisions.
Its not rocket science.
Click to expand...

Nope.
The trains and the railway system were safer back in 2010-ish than it is nowadays. Budget cuts, underfunding, understaffing and lay-offs over the years (there should have been at least two station masters at each station), a centralized train monitor system that was dismantled in 2020 (acting as a safeguard, in case of human error), delays over delays in implementing the European Train Control System, thefts-pillaging of copper wire that has degraded part of the railway system (meaning that station masters have to reroute trains to a different track in various parts), the alleged error of the train master and the deceased train conductor of the passenger train, and the list goes on and on.


Here the Greek reporter explains.

 
Mohonky

Mohonky

Member
GymWolf said:
How the fuck can this happen with all the radio communication and stuff?

Rip.
Click to expand...
Human error.

Just watch Air Crash Investigations / Mayday, it is scary how the most basic things don't get picked up on and the consequences of them.

The one where they covered the pito tubes with tape while cleaning the plane and forgot to remove the tape causing the plane to go down is literally amazing to me that such a vital piece of equipment is so easily rendered useless and can slhave such a dramatic effect.
 
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