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[DynamiteCop!]

https://www.vg247.com/2019/03/21/vampire-the-masquerade-bloodlines-2-political-character-creator/



Bloodlines 2: “It’s definitely taking political stances on what we think are right and wrong”

To further bring it up to date, it’s been a conscious decision by Hardsuit Labs for Bloodlines 2 to reflect fifteen years of change in the game and real world, and its setting of Seattle. The developer is taking a refreshing approach of weaving politics into the game, both in terms of narrative and gameplay.

One of the reasons we went to Seattle for Bloodlines 2 is there’s a lot of conflict in Seattle that is a microcosm of a lot of conflict that’s going on all over the place.

It’s not just politics where Vampire: The Masquerade – Bloodlines 2 takes a progressive approach. The character creator, which players get to use twice – once at the start to define your human aspects and then a second time later in the game to flesh out your vampire – goes way beyond basic male and female models. Body type, gender pronouns, employment history and fashion can all be toyed with for a very modular build.

It just felt like a good place to start to ground it; the conflict between tradition and progress

Oh it's another "us versus them" game, another "right side of history" narrative, another "our ideals need to be broadcast into entertainment" product... Wonderful.. Oh it's also taking place in Seattle which is a left leaning cesspool of continued societal and economic disaster...

I can't wait...

 

[Xaero Gravity]

I'm really not a fan of politics being shoved down my throat in games, but at the same time I've been praying for this games existence for years so I'm really conflicted on this.

 

[mcz117chief]

Yeah, that is why I am keeping my enthusiasm in check, they can't ruin the 1st game for me so I'm happy with that if the second one ends up a dud.

 

[angelic]

Curb it even harder, this sjw harpie is on board.

 

[Agent_4Seven]

 

[Screamer-RSA]

I think it still a bit too early to start raising the pitch forks. After all vg247 is trash right up there with any other political garbage like Polygon etc and of course they will report on things that support their bias.

Once we see more and the game has a more neutral stance, I mean lets the player do whatever they like how they like, be whatever they want then who cares. Forced shit obviously is a no go, but lets not be like those other looneys and try an censor everything we don't like.

 

[DynamiteCop!]

I think it still a bit too early to start raising the pitch forks. After all vg247 is trash right up there with any other political garbage like Polygon etc and of course they will report on things that support their bias.

Once we see more and the game has a more neutral stance, I mean lets the player do whatever they like how they like, be whatever they want then who cares. Forced shit obviously is a no go, but lets not be like those other looneys and try an censor everything we don't like.

See

Curb it even harder, this sjw harpie is on board.

 

[Wolfgang Jr]

Great, trannys biting each other the game.

 

[MadYarpen]

Wait, they are making Bloodlines 2?

Thats hype. Are people from Troika involved?

 

[brap]

I hope there's a fat orange hitler we can kill LOL

 

[DynamiteCop!]

I hope there's a fat orange hitler we can kill LOL

Oh here we go with the Trump is Hitler posts...

 

[mcz117chief]

Oh here we go with the Trump is Hitler posts...

Pretty sure it was intended in jest.

 

[TyphoonStruggle]

Wait for more information or some reputable reviews as it's released.

Contain your respective hype/outrage.

 

[DynamiteCop!]

Wait for more information or some reputable reviews as it's released.

Contain your respective hype/outrage.

You do realize mere hours after announcement this is the first information the developers deemed as vital to being disclosed...

Case closed bud, put it in the ground.

 

[brap]

Oh here we go with the Trump is Hitler posts...

lmao I was just joking dude

 

[DynamiteCop!]

lmao I was just joking dude

You just can't tell anymore, for you it was a joke post for someone else they would actually say that.

 

[Red Crayon Aristocrat]

It's just the way modern culture is, everything is infused with politics, there's no real point in not just learning to deal with it.

The media I consume doesn't have to 1:1 reflect my personal beliefs, I don't believe in echo chambers, so long as the story is still good, that's all that matters.

My only concern would be a lack of sexual content, as that wouldn't be true to Vampire The Masquerade at all, but the big breasted woman seen in the trailer seems to imply that's not something to worry about.

 

[Helios]

>Enter thread
>see vg247 link
>exit thread

Spoiler

Is what I should've done, but instead I'm writing this reply

 

[Steez]

I'm really not a fan of politics being shoved down my throat in games, but at the same time I've been praying for this games existence for years so I'm really conflicted on this.

Hardsuit Labs, formerly known as Zombie Studios before they went bankrupt.

This is their catalogue.

https://www.metacritic.com/company/zombie-studios

This might as well just be as much Bloodlines as Bioware is """""""""Bioware""""""""" in 2019.

 

[Barnabot]

Well so now when you play the game you [as a vampire] will need to suck up people's entire mind instead of just their blood?

 

[GenericUser]

That's kinda sad, the scenario has a lot of potential, why spoil it with politics?

 

[Spukc]

Amazing i always thought tackling complex gender issues should be done in an occult fantasy vampire video game.
Thanks devs!

 

[MadYarpen]

Hardsuit Labs, formerly known as Zombie Studios before they went bankrupt.

This is their catalogue.

https://www.metacritic.com/company/zombie-studios

This might as well just be as much Bloodlines as Bioware is """""""""Bioware""""""""" in 2019.

That's what I fear the most. But in a worst case scenario this will be an excuse to play original one once again.

 

[mcz117chief]

You just can't tell anymore, for you it was a joke post for someone else they would actually say that.

Brap is a stand up lad, mate. He would never say anything like that seriously.

 

[Husky]

Sounds like I can play as a trap, don't see an issue with that.

 

[Dunki]

See stuff like this sounds terrible

 

[Fuz]

Let's ruin Vampire too.

I'm a fan of Bloodlines and I'm very afraid of the direction they're gonna take.
The first game was pretty political as well, but it was neither preachy not hamfisted. I'm afraid this one will be.

If this goes that way, it's a lost sale from me.

 

[Fuz]

Well so now when you play the game you [as a vampire] will need to suck up people's entire mind instead of just their blood?

You're gonna need to ask for consent before biting them.

 

[levyjl1988]

I hope we get the first game to launch on consoles. I hate playing sequel games and have no clue on what’s happening. It’s like players getting on Destiny 2 without playing Destiny 1, and it’s like wtf happened. Or playing Witcher 2 without playing Witcher 1. Previous games need to be ported and brought back to consoles so the audience can experience it. I have a shitty mobile phone and my mac mini is a piece of shit to play the first game.

 

[shark sandwich]

I always wanted to role play as a terrifying creature of the night who also keeps his male privilege in check and never assumes someone’s gender.

 

[Revolutionary]

Hardsuit Labs, formerly known as Zombie Studios before they went bankrupt.

This is their catalogue.

https://www.metacritic.com/company/zombie-studios

This might as well just be as much Bloodlines as Bioware is """""""""Bioware""""""""" in 2019.

Yeah... this is probably going to be one to avoid, folks.

I hope we get the first game to launch on consoles. I hate playing sequel games and have no clue on what’s happening. It’s like players getting on Destiny 2 without playing Destiny 1, and it’s like wtf happened. Or playing Witcher 2 without playing Witcher 1. Previous games need to be ported and brought back to consoles so the audience can experience it. I have a shitty mobile phone and my mac mini is a piece of shit to play the first game.

The original game has fundamental gameplay problems that would require too much work for a port that probably wouldn't sell much anyway.

 

[h3ad0rZ]

My only concern would be a lack of sexual content, as that wouldn't be true to Vampire The Masquerade at all, but the big breasted woman seen in the trailer seems to imply that's not something to worry about.

Do you mean her?

Honestly, I don't mean to be rude, but her face looks like it already had surgery to be up-to date to the "current standards".

 

[Azula]

They certainly have every right to make their game political. But consumers have every right to not buy it if they don’t like the way the product handles these things. Goes without saying.

My personal rule on these things, is that I always wait to see if the game has a good story. If it’s well written. It’s possible to disagree 100% with a creators political views, or the politics pushed in art / entertainment- while also enjoying it. If something is well written and is a great game, then you could enjoy it while also completely disagreeing with the devs view points that are in the game.

That said, I don’t have a lot of hope here. When a dev jumps out the gate and says their game will be heavily poltical socially, and that they will be showing the conflict between two sides, you already know they are going to take one side. Which is already reflected in all the game options.

That in itself isn’t a problem. But I also highly doubt they will give the other side a fair shake. So this is prob gonna just be a preaching game, where it’s used as an activist platform. Then you got them hiring Cara Ellison. So I think we know how this will shake out.

Hope I’m wrong. Was waiting for this sequel forever. And it feels like they are missing all the points as to why we loved the original. And are instead using modern social activism to redefine a lot of it.

 

[Teslerum]

It’s fifteen years later and things have changed,” Mitsoda said. “We have to be very sensitive about how we handle things like mental illness and that was a concern for us and for Paradox, in how we can make a mature story but if we do anything, we do our homework and make sure that we are punching up and not punching down.”

“We talk about these issues constantly,” Ellison added. “Because we care about including people, we want them to feel powerful and sexy, and we don’t want them to feel like it’s not for them.”

He... He used the punching up/down rhetoric. Seriously.

I....... Its worse than I imagined.

 

[Tesseract]

fine make it political if you want to, but if it's grossly one sided i'm gonna laugh my ass off

progressives are often wrong

 

[Sqorin Hammerfarf]

The things being said make me think that this is going to be another political Mary Sue experience where characters exist just to show how enlightened the authors are. When a real author talks about their work, they say very different things than a social justice fan fiction writer - and unfortunately, I have yet to see a worked described in this way that didn’t end up cringy and insulting.

 

[Barnabot]

You're gonna need to ask for consent before biting them.

To suck blood? Maybe. But to indoctrinate you ? lol. I think there's no consent on that.

 

[Winter John]

You people realise that vampires dress in velvet capes and creep into dude's bedrooms right?

 

[DadEggs]

the only modern day conflict going on in seattle are housing prices

 

[Jenenser]

U guys are weird.
A vampiregame more than lends itself to be sexualy ambigous. If these are options, they are options.

can someone tell me what exactly is the issue with this choice? or is this just a "Mah games" thing?

 

[Xaero Gravity]

Hardsuit Labs, formerly known as Zombie Studios before they went bankrupt.

This is their catalogue.

https://www.metacritic.com/company/zombie-studios

This might as well just be as much Bloodlines as Bioware is """""""""Bioware""""""""" in 2019.

Shit...

 

[GrayChild]

As someone who can be described as a rather conservative person, I do not have any problems than that. Apart from the stupid gender pronouns, pretty much all of this was in the original Bloodlines as well.

I'd be disappointed only if they show their political bias in a cringy, patronizing or extremely one-sided way.

Going from Mitsoda's words on Eurogamer:

"But also the tone of the game - it's 2019 now. We have to update the tone, we're not going to make a 2004 game in 2019, we're going to approach subjects a little differently and with a lot more research and respect than was done back then."

I'd be more worried if the authors succumb to self-censorship. The first Bloodlines didn't pull any punches mocking different cultures and stereotypes.

 

[Shai-Tan]

The things being said make me think that this is going to be another political Mary Sue experience where characters exist just to show how enlightened the authors are. When a real author talks about their work, they say very different things than a social justice fan fiction writer - and unfortunately, I have yet to see a worked described in this way that didn’t end up cringy and insulting.

but the same was said about many games before release that subsequently turned out not to be the case. I remember some easily triggered people banging on and on about the matriarchal society in Horizon: Zero Dawn as evidence the story would be colored by current year progressive bona fides.

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

I’m beginning to hate the term “shoved down my throat.”

Gets thrown out every time a creative decision is made involving diversity/inclusion/politics in games, and its rarely ever that extreme. Very hyperbolic term and an overused term as well.

In my opinion, of course.

V:TM was one of my favorite games ever. This sequel is a dream come true for me.

You can’t control what devs do with their visions and projects, you can control how you react to it. Feel free to support it, feel free not to support it. I’m not going to let anything deter me from the unbridled joy of playing another V:TM experience, period.

 

[Teslerum]

As someone who can be described as a rather conservative person, I do not have any problems than that. Apart from the stupid gender pronouns, pretty much all of this was in the original Bloodlines as well.

I'd be disappointed only if they show their political bias in a cringy, patronizing or extremely one-sided way.

Going from Mitsoda's words on Eurogamer:



I'd be more worried if the authors succumb to self-censorship. The first Bloodlines didn't pull any punches mocking different cultures and stereotypes.

That is exactly it, from Cara Ellison to Mitsoda questioning Bloodlines (including how it approached mental illness\Jeanette) to straight up SJW rethoroc (Do not *punch down*).

I doubt Bloodlines humorous, but excellent approach will survive.

 

[Xaero Gravity]

I’m beginning to hate the term “shoved down my throat.”

Gets thrown out every time a creative decision is made involving diversity/inclusion/politics in games, and its rarely ever that extreme. Very hyperbolic term and an overused term as well.

In my opinion, of course.

V:TM was one of my favorite games ever. This sequel is a dream come true for me.

You can’t control what devs do with their visions and projects, you can control how you react to it. Feel free to support it, feel free not to support it. I’m not going to let anything deter me from the unbridled joy of playing another V:TM experience, period.

@ me if you're going to call me out

 

[Sqorin Hammerfarf]

but the same was said about many games before release that subsequently turned out not to be the case. I remember some easily triggered people banging on and on about the matriarchal society in Horizon: Zero Dawn as evidence the story would be colored by current year progressive bona fides.

You named the only counter example I could think of when I was writing that post. I tried to see if I could think of any counter examples that could be used against me, and I was like Anthem? Mass Effect? Dragon Age? Dishonored? Watchdogs 2? Battlefield? Ghostbusters? Star Wars? Star Trek? Captain Marvel? Powerpuff Girls? Every Marvel comic from the past 5 years?... and then I was like Horizon? Hmm. Didn't play it, but maybe. That's okay, if anyone brings up Horizon, I'll just mention EVERYTHING ELSE.

 

[Sub_Level]

The devs are free to make their game political and customers are free to make their purchase decision and/or critique based off of it ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

I guess it’s just one of those things that people will always be divided on.

Such is life.

We’ll see what actually makes it into the game, don’t give up hope on it just yet.

 

[Teslerum]

You named the only counter example I could think of when I was writing that post. I tried to see if I could think of any counter examples that could be used against me, and I was like Anthem? Mass Effect? Dragon Age? Dishonored? Watchdogs 2? Battlefield? Ghostbusters? Star Wars? Captain Marvel? Powerpuff Girls? Every Marvel comic from the past 5 years?... and then I was like Horizon? Hmm. Didn't play it, but maybe. That's okay, if anyone brings up Horizon, I'll just mention EVERYTHING ELSE.

Even Horizon had feminist undertones especially in sidequests. That said theres only one quest thats really on the nose so its not bad and quite tolerable/good. Theres one negative in Horizon compared to other games though that there is no real personality choice. So I ended up being annoyed with Alloy multiple times which felt a bit cringy in an western rpg.