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Metal Gear Solid 4 Guns of The Patriots 2.0 |OT| Kept you waiting, huh?
- Thread starter GoncaloCCastro
- Start date
Live Free or Die
Banned
Best game of all time.
Professor Beef
Banned
You know what? This game is FANTASTIC.
It's GAF's goty! Lots of annoying people just repeatedly pop up over and over in every LTTP thread saying the same thing. Gaf, on the whole, loved the game...and continued to like it 4x later. Which makes sense, cause the gameplay is pretty undisputedly fukawesome.
Femmeworth
Banned
I don't know, it's quite flawed. The production values are through the roof, but the script is god awful and the gameplay has its share of issues. It's certainly enjoyable though.
matrix-cat
Member
I can't decide whether MGS4 is the worst best game ever or the best worst game ever. There's no one part I like that I don't also hate at least a little bit. It's like a glorious trainwreck of a game, a fantastic story told in the worst way possible. It has such terrible pacing, such a woeful script, yet it's still completely amazing. I think every MGS fan has a line when it comes to just how much of Kojima's bullshit they can stand, but MGS4 went so far over that line for me and I still absolutely love the game. I just hate certain parts of it. Most of it. Some of it? I don't even know.
I imagine that, as Sony consoles got more powerful and the MGS series continued to make more money for Konami, Kojima was given more and more freedom to turn his bizarre ideas into reality, and MGS4 represents the zenith of all his brilliance and insanity. To me it has the highest highs and the lowest lows of the entire saga, the purest expression of one crazy man's mind. There's nothing else like it in the world of video games.
I imagine that, as Sony consoles got more powerful and the MGS series continued to make more money for Konami, Kojima was given more and more freedom to turn his bizarre ideas into reality, and MGS4 represents the zenith of all his brilliance and insanity. To me it has the highest highs and the lowest lows of the entire saga, the purest expression of one crazy man's mind. There's nothing else like it in the world of video games.
Combichristoffersen
Combovers don't work when there is no hair
Playing MGS1 for the first time now, and let me get this straight, since MGS4 was kinda convoluted about it all.. In MGS1 you fight Revolver Ocelot, who gets his arm cut off, and later you fight and kill Liquid Snake, right? Then Revolver Ocelot has Liquid's arm grafted onto his body to replace the arm he lost, but Liquid's will still resides in his arm (we're going into 'my wife is my arm lol Bionic Commando' territory here), causing Ocelot to adapt Liquid's persona. But then it turns out Liquid's will wasn't in his arm, Ocelot just used hypnosis and drugs to plant Liquid's personality in his mind. Is this right? And why did Ocelot adapt Liquid's persona to begin with?
Yes, imo its to screw with the Patriot system. This made him unpredictable to them.
Femmeworth
Banned
To fool the Patriots or some bullshit like that. Fuck if I know.
Combichristoffersen
Combovers don't work when there is no hair
I read the MGSWiki article on Ocelot, and apparently Liquid's spirit was originally in the arm Ocelot had grafted onto his body, and it would occasionally possess Ocelot. Ocelot then had the arm removed to restore balance to his mind, and replaced it with a cybernetic arm. He then used drugs and hypnosis to merge Liquid's personality with his own to become Liquid Ocelot in order to fool the Patriots.
I.. what.
Whatever Kojima is smoking, I want some of it.
Don't remember that being mentioned anywhere, this is directly from the game's script:
And that was all the explanation offered (and needed, really) on the matter.
Combichristoffersen
Combovers don't work when there is no hair
The 'possession' stuff apparently happened during MGS2 (which I've never played), but the article wasn't entirely clear on whether these were actual possessions by Liquid's spirit or just a result of Ocelot's use of drugs and psychotherapy (but it seemed like it was implying they were actual possessions).
That's what people thought might be after MGS2 and finding out who Ocelot's father was in MGS3, before we got the actual explanation in MGS4.
I originally loved MGS4 but once it all sank in the plot/script had so many problems that it ruined the credibility of the MGS franchises story, hence it completely ruined the experience.
MGS4 gameplay on the other hand, was great.
I think most people on GAF have "that game that GAF hates, but I love."
I played MGS 3 like 10 times at least...Who is Ocelot's father? I have not heard of this.
Combichristoffersen
Combovers don't work when there is no hair
I believe the Metal Gear Solid Database (available on PSN Store), does support that Ocelot was actually possessed in MGS2. Plus, if it was an act in MGS2, there would be no reason for him to remove the arm. If anything cutting the arm off would hurt the illusion. Of course it's very likely he wanted Liquid to control him in MGS2 to set the stage and illusion for MGS4.
It's never totally clear either way. Which I fully believe is intentional. Ocelot has always been the mysterious character in the franchise...you could never tell for sure who's side he was on. After hours and hours thinking about the whole thing, that is the conclusion I came to.
Catalix
And on the sixth day the LORD David Bowie created man and woman in His image. And he saw that it was good. On the seventh day the LORD created videogames so that He might take the bloody day off for once.
But if the spirit possessions were never genuine at any point, why did Ocelot remove Liquid's real arm and replace it with a synthetic one?
I think he got scurred and chopped that shit right off.
edit: @NeoUltima
yeah, that's basically how I see it, too.
It was never said outright but was hinted at in the game. We know the Boss and Sorrow were close and had a child and that child was taken away. In a radio conversation we are told that Ocelot's mother had an S or snake shaped scar (can't remember) and then at the end we see that the Boss had that scar on her body. She got the scar due to complications while giving birth
I haven't read the database but have heard quite a few times about it being inaccurate about various things (which is why I didn't bother reading it). This is why I only accept about the story what I see in the actual games.
And you are spot on with your conclusion, if it messed with us it would mess big time with an AI as well.
Can't say really, it wasn't explained in the game.
Catalix
And on the sixth day the LORD David Bowie created man and woman in His image. And he saw that it was good. On the seventh day the LORD created videogames so that He might take the bloody day off for once.
Kinda interesting that they chose to never directly address it in the game itself, considering it's such a huge missing link. Fun to speculate the reasoning behind it, though. Glad they at least left something to the imagination
I still think the funniest part about the twist is that
it involves Ocelot tricking himself - practically the last person in the entire series that Ocelot hadn't already fooled.
Makes me wonder if that bit of irony was intentional or not.
345triangle
Member
anyone who doesn't acknowledge the game's flaws is on crack. i agree that the game plays amazingly well, at least for the first two chapters before it completely stops playing like that. after chapter three the entire thing is just a total mess - story, gameplay, ratio of story to gameplay, everything. i didn't not enjoy it, but it was through a lens of utter disbelief at how something like this could ever have been produced for so much money.
it's the only MGS i haven't played through multiple times for a very good reason (though i'm going to give it another go once i'm done with 3 on vita). five chapters that played like the first two? we'd have been looking at the best MGS game ever. unfortunately, that is kind of not at all what happened.
Kinda interesting that they chose to never directly address it in the game itself, considering it's such a huge missing link. Fun to speculate the reasoning behind it, though. Glad they at least left something to the imagination
I still think the funniest part about the twist is thatit involves Ocelot tricking himself - practically the last person in the entire series that Ocelot hadn't already fooled.
Makes me wonder if that bit of irony was intentional or not.
Lol, that is pretty funny now that you mention it, nice catch.
But yeah, I don't mind this bit being left unclear either.
this game fixes my biggest problem with MGS3, having to access menu to change camo. The game automatically does it for you.
Another thing I like is that they did away with the whole survival thing, in MGS3 it was cool at first but then it just got annoying.
Another thing I like is that they did away with the whole survival thing, in MGS3 it was cool at first but then it just got annoying.
phosphor112
Banned
All of fucking Act 3. I did the save glitch though, so I cut down on the bullshit fluff time, but this bike scene. God damn, I've never hated this game until now.
BeautifulMemory
Member
yeah, that and the last fight, on how to bring shitty experience to your game 101
phosphor112
Banned
I can't even equip my metal camo >=/
BeautifulMemory
Member
and watch your health go bye bye >:0
Yeah, first two acts are fun, but yeah, it goes to shit from there. The 4th act has a cool environment, but it's lacking significant gameplay. It's a drag playing 3-5 just to replay the good stuff with the new equipment.
Femmeworth
Banned
There's no defending the bike chase, complete crap. The bike chase in 3 was better. The stalking section isn't exactly quality game design either.
devastatorprime
Member
Alright I just finished my first playthrough, almost forgot how epic this game was. I got 24 trophies and 8 emblems. The emblems are
Eagle
Hawk
Frog
Hyena
Hog
Pig
Cow
Panther
Any suggestions for how I should go about my 2nd playthrough? The reason it takes at least 8 playthroughs for a platinum is beacuse of all the emblems correct?
Any help or general strats are much appreciated.
Eagle
Hawk
Frog
Hyena
Hog
Pig
Cow
Panther
Any suggestions for how I should go about my 2nd playthrough? The reason it takes at least 8 playthroughs for a platinum is beacuse of all the emblems correct?
Any help or general strats are much appreciated.
Killing_Joke
Member
I don't think even Kojima has a full explanation for Ocelot. But my theory is Operation save Big Boss came into full gear when Ocelot started playing triple agent for Liquid, Solidus and the Patriots. With Liquid dead he can use his powers from his dad to fool the Patriots into thinking Liquid took over. Which means he's no longer in control of the Patriots and the rest of the plan can go as is. It's seriously the only thing that makes sense for me. With BB's explanation, MGS2 just never fucking happened. Sorry Kojima, as hard as you try you can't retcon that shit.
zerokoolpsx
Member
Normally Chicken Emblem run first. It knocks out these emblems.
On this playthrough for emblems you will hope to unlock:
40.) Chicken - Your target emblem
Requirements are:
Alert Phases: Over 150
Kills: Over 500
Continues: Over 50
Total time: Over 35 hours
Healing items used: Over 50
28.) Pig - Will unlock automatically
29.) Cow - Will unlock automatically
30.) Crocodile - Will unlock automatically
31.) Giant Panda - Will unlock automatically
39.) Puma - Will unlock automatically
Kills:
9.) Bear - Grab 100 enemies with CQC.
10.) Eagle - 150 headshots
27.) Hog - Achieve a battle high ten times.
Time:
13.) Blue Bird - Give 50 items at least to allies
14.) Hawk (this should really go under kills I guess but whatever) - Receive praise 25 times from allies
16.) Ant - Body search 50 enemies
17.) Gibbon - Hold up 50 enemies
18.) Tortoise - 60 minutes in a box
19.) Rabbit - Turn 100 pages in a playboy magazine
20.) Bee - Inject fifty enemies with the syringe/plug
21.) Gekko - Hug a wall for an hour.
22.) Scarab - Roll forward at least two hundred times
23.) Frog - Roll sideways two hundred times
24.) Inch Worm - Crawl for an hour
25.) Lobster - Crouch for two hours and thirty minutes
26.) Hyena - Pick up four hundred items.
2nd playthrough can either be Assassin/Tarantula emblem or BBE. Completing BBE knocks out 10 emblems.
2nd/3rd playthrough
1.) Big Boss Emblem - Beat the game on the highest difficulty (The Boss Extreme) with no deaths, no alerts, no kills, no recovery items, no stealth suit, no bandana items, in under 5 hours.
2.) Fox Hound Emblem - Will unlock automatically
3.) Fox Emblem - Will unlock automatically
4.) Hound Emblem - Will unlock automatically
5.) Mantis Emblem - Will unlock automatically
6.) Wolf Emblem - Will unlock automatically
7.) Raven Emblem - Will unlock automatically
8.) Octopus Emblem - Will unlock automatically
12.) Pigeon Emblem - Will unlock automatically
32.) Scorpion Emblem - Will unlock automatically
or
2nd/3rd playthrough
11.) Assassin Emblem
Beat the game with 50+ knife kills/stuns, 50+ CQC holds, and 25 or less alerts.
Simply press near an enemy to grab them with CQC, and kill enemies with your knife by holding pressing while holding them. Alternatively, you can press + with your Stun Knife equipped to stab them, or + to stun them.
33.) Tarantula Emblem
Get less than 75 alert phases, over 250 kills, and less than 25 continues.
15.) Little Gray Emblem (Have plenty of time to collect this emblem on your subsequent playthroughs)
Collect all 69 weapons.
Collect all of the weapons, except for the M1911 Custom.
Each one requires one playthrough.
34.) Centipede Emblem
Get less than 75 alert phases, less than 250 kills, and over 25 continues.
35.) Spider Emblem
Get less than 75 alert phases, over 250 kills, and over 25 continues.
36.) Jaguar Emblem
Get over 75 alert phases, less than 250 kills, and less than 25 continues.
37.) Panther Emblem
Get over 75 alert phases, over 250 kills, and less than 25 continues.
38.) Leopard Emblem
Get over 75 alert phases, less than 250 kills, and over 25 continues.
All 40 emblems!
Of course it doesn't have to be completed in this order.
For me it's got the best moments in the series and also the worst moments in the series.
devastatorprime
Member
Amazing, that is extremely helpful, thank you so much.
SirIgbyCeaser
Banned
I don't know what I want. I don't know if I want to finish MGS -> MGS4, before jumping back into MGS4 entirely. Or just to play MGS4 and than return to the other games.
Combichristoffersen
Combovers don't work when there is no hair
HD Collection ordered! Ordered a near mint copy of MGS1 too, since I like to own physical copies of my music, games and movies. Time to dig into the series for real.
The One Who Knocks
Member
Excellent choice. I know you said you weren't a fan of the stealth that is present within the Metal Gear Solid games but I highly advise you try them on Normal at least. Hopefully by playing through them (while not just running through them on Very Easy) on a difficulty that still poses a challenge yet isn't too difficult the gameplay may become more appealing to you.
Good! Incredible games. MGS1 remains my favourite (ans favourite game ever) but i love them all.
Combichristoffersen
Combovers don't work when there is no hair
I'm playing MGS1 on easy currently (Very Easy isn't available in the original version of MGS1, only in the re-release with the VR missions IIRC) and it's not too bad, as the game is fairly liberal with ammo and rations, and the stealth sections aren't too bad. Most of the time I've actually died because of the clunky controls, although Revolver Ocelot was fairly tough for being the first boss.
Yeah, I really enjoy the story so far. Although I still wonder why Psycho Mantis looks like he came straight from a cybergoth club, like this guy.
guys, can i get the ant, gibbon and bear emblems using the resistance guy at the beginning of act 3?
i read that for bear you just have to grab it, not choke or knife him.
and what about ant?, should i just cycle through all the triangle possibilities and avoid only the crotch one, again and again and again?
thanks!
i read that for bear you just have to grab it, not choke or knife him.
and what about ant?, should i just cycle through all the triangle possibilities and avoid only the crotch one, again and again and again?
thanks!
matrix-cat
Member
It'll be difficult. Honestly I'd restart if I were you, because the first two Acts are really the only points where you can grind for kills. You can try and kill all the FROGs on Outer Haven, die and continue and repeat, but it'll be slow going. Although, that might help you in the long run with making up the 35 hours for the Chicken emblem. It just depends on how patient you are.
phosphor112
Banned
I actually like the bike chase, it's just bullshit stupid hard when playing it on BBE. Bullshit is putting it nicely.
BIONIC-ARRRMMM!!
Member
You know you can actually move and shoot in MGS1, right?
Combichristoffersen
Combovers don't work when there is no hair
Are you thinking of Ocelot? He was hard mainly because he would be off-screen a lot of the time during the fight, so I couldn't really see where he was or what he was doing.
BIONIC-ARRRMMM!!
Member
Yeah I know, but if you keep X+Square held you can just keep following him around!