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LA Times: Microsoft announces X360 pricing at lollapalooza 2005

Stinkles said:
Then you probably own an Xbox.

Which proves once and for all, that backward compatibility is a convenience, not a feature.


PS2 owners already know this.

except the drive it in is on it's last legs.

and you're right, it's just a convenience. i mean, who cares about things being CONVENIENT? that shit sucks ass.
 

Beowvlf

Banned
pilonv1 said:
Besides raping the early adopters, that was one of my thoughts. #1 market subsidises their worst market, Japan gamers am win.
Totally. All seventeen of those gamers/Microsoft Games Studio Japan employees are, as we speak, pounding back sake and running naked through Akihibara screaming 'ARTOON FOR TEH WINZ!!!'.

The countdown to Magatama 360 has begun!
 

Reilly

Member
Entertaining thread. I read all 18 pages so far.


If the PS3 has everything promised standard, then I'll have no problem paying $399.


I bet Square-Enix is happy that their beloved FF11 won't be playable by some of it's XBOX user base. :lol
 

Nerevar

they call me "Man Gravy".
Vark said:
People are upset because the internet lied to them, fanboy speculation went rampant and MS didn't step up to correct any of it. They never said the HD was going to be 'standard' they said it would come with the 1 SKU they had planned.

People need to realize the 299 'core' system may as well not exist. That's not the Xbox360 the Xbox360 is the 400 dollar one. The 300 dollar one is there so it looks cheapers to consumers that aren't paying attention and so they can say its there.

2 points of contention:

1) is everyone going crazy? Didn't Allard state unequivocally that every xbox360 would have a HDD included at e3? Or did we all miss something?

2) Do you really think the $400 system will outsell the $300 one? Outside of MS forcing people to purchase the more expensive bundle by creating unrealistic shortages of the "core" system, I'd eat my shoe if the $400 system sells more. They've essentially made the HDD in x360 no different from the HDD in PS3 - i.e. an optional component that is ridiculously overpriced and no one has. It's a feature downgrade.
 

teiresias

Member
For all we'll know Sony will pull a dual-SKU fiasco themselves, one with BluRay and one without. Sound far fetched? Well, so is today's news.

Today's news is not far fetched to those of us that grew a brain before this morning.
 

rastex

Banned
Mrbob said:
The base package isn't even HD ERA ready and this is what MS had been preaching since the beginning.

Think in demographics for a second. HDTV prices are still much higher than normal tvs. For someone to want the HD Era components, they're going to have an HDTV. And if they have an HDTV then 99% chance the extra $100 for the premium pack will be insignificant as well. And you can say "oh, what about college students and their monitors?" well they'd have to buy the VGA cable no matter what package they went with.
 

Gregory

Banned
Wow, the official price for the core system in Scandiavia is supposedly 2500kr (400 dollars).
Very cheap actually. That`s the same price as the fucking PSP will launch at here.

MS screwing us over? I don`t think so.
 

Tarazet

Member
Dr_Cogent said:
See, thats just the thing, they have it priced so everyone is going to think the 400 dollar SKU is a deal.

It is a deal. A great deal, in fact, so much so that it could easily sell out - and then poor Mr. Customer has to buy a $300 base model, a $50 wireless controller, a $30 remote, a $20 headset, a $40 HDTV cable, and a $100 hard drive. Then if they want to go online that's another $100 - total of $640. That sucks.
 

Mrbob

Member
rastex said:
Think in demographics for a second. HDTV prices are still much higher than normal tvs. For someone to want the HD Era components, they're going to have an HDTV. And if they have an HDTV then 99% chance the extra $100 for the premium pack will be insignificant as well. And you can say "oh, what about college students and their monitors?" well they'd have to buy the VGA cable no matter what package they went with.


Doesn't matter. It still goes against what MS has been preaching for months. They could at least include component cables in the box too.

Like I've mentioned before it isn't the hardware price that bugs me. It's the split skus and the peripheral prices and game prices.
 

IJoel

Member
While I think the Premium Pack is a good deal, it's just sucks that the common SKU won't include the hard disk. This will most likely mean that developers won't even try to optimize for HDD usage, which I think was a very nice feature for the Xbox. Also it just sends a mixed message to those waiting for backwards compatibility (having to get the premium pack for it.)

I'm all for giving the customer options, but not at the expense of what I value as important core features.

This also means one more thing...

NO BLINX 360!!! :(

Blinx_Render.jpg
 

Mama Smurf

My penis is still intact.
I thought most people in the thread were more bothered by things like the accessories pricing than the $399 price. Not all of course. Seems to be a lot of damage control about things which don't need controlling that much.
 
Yusaku said:
I think the massive 360 backlash right now is partly because many Xbox fans have egg on their face for making assumptions.
Assumptions based on...oh, I don't know...press releases like the one geek posted 3 posts above you?

Yeah, silly us. :lol
 

kenta

Has no PEINS
DopeyFish said:
ever count the amount of connectors on the HD cable? in the premium picture?

There's 6.

Why would there be 6?

Red / Green / Blue / Video / sound-L / sound-R

Composite comes with the premium box too
There are only 5 connectors for component, homeboy. Red, Green and Blue are the video connectors, then the two audio connectors. Anyway, carry on. :)
 

cyberheater

PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 Xbone PS4 PS4
210 quid for a UK 360 is awesome :)

What's not to like...
 

human5892

Queen of Denmark
Mama Smurf said:
I thought most people in the thread were more bothered by things like the accessories pricing than the $399 price. Not all of course. Seems to be a lot of damage control about things which don't need controlling that much.
Yeah, I think the main issues here are 1.) a guarantee for minimal hard drive utilization due to the SKU split, and 2.) accessories costing eight trillion dollars. If you were surprised by the $399 price, you probably haven't been paying too much attention.
 

SuperPac

Member
So when will EB and Gamestop post up their special preorder bundles that come with cleaning kits and extraneous accessories to add $100's more to the price? :D
 

rastex

Banned
Mrbob said:
Doesn't matter. It still goes against what MS has been preaching for months. They could at least include component cables in the box too.

What do you mean it doesn't matter? It's the ONLY thing that matters. Preaching? Preaching to who? Out of the 3 million people that will buy the 360 this holiday how many do you think have been following Xbox news like us at GAF or other videogame boards? Don't you realize that we don't matter? That we're entirely insignificant to the market.
 

DopeyFish

Not bitter, just unsweetened
kenta said:
There are only 5 connectors for component, homeboy. Red, Green and Blue are the video connectors, then the two audio connectors. Anyway, carry on. :)

look at the picture.

RGB component is 3, sound is 2. There are 6 RCA cables indicated in that picture.

Last one has to be composite video.
 

Vark

Member
Nerevar said:
2 points of contention:

1) is everyone going crazy? Didn't Allard state unequivocally that every xbox360 would have a HDD included at e3? Or did we all miss something?

2) Do you really think the $400 system will outsell the $300 one? Outside of MS forcing people to purchase the more expensive bundle by creating unrealistic shortages of the "core" system, I'd eat my shoe if the $400 system sells more. They've essentially made the HDD in x360 no different from the HDD in PS3 - i.e. an optional component that is ridiculously overpriced and no one has. It's a feature downgrade.

1) He said that for the SKU they had planned at the time that the HD would come with that SKU (this SKU being the 400 dollar one). There was always the idea to release an HDDless cheaper version later in the lifespace. They never said the HD would be STANDARD on every x360 sold. Which is why games have to be able to run without it (something thats been known for a very, very long time.

The 299 HD-less SKU was the one added after the fact. They just decided to make that SKU available earlier apparently. Initially they weren't planning on offering a cheaper version at launch and i'm sure the only reason they did was PR posturing.

2) Yes, I absolutely do. Because people will see a 50 dollar controll and a 100 dollar HDD add on and say 'well for just 100 I get both in the 'value' pack'.


The real problem is this is all backwards. We're used to seeing a 'core' system as a baseline and then a value pack with extras for more. Here the baseline is the value edition and there's a spinoff 'cheaper' version attached at the last minute. (Which is backwards and slightly counter intuitive).
 

vatstep

This poster pulses with an appeal so broad the typical restraints of our societies fall by the wayside.
DopeyFish said:
look at the picture.

RGB component is 3, sound is 2. There are 6 RCA cables indicated in that picture.

Last one has to be composite video.
It is. It's pretty unnecessary, since any of the red, green or blue cables would do the trick. The yellow cable is just included so that people don't get confused.
 
cyberheater said:
210 quid for a UK 360 is awesome :)

What's not to like...

you dont get a HDD for that price.

you cant play your games in HD for that price.

you cant save your game for that price.

etc etc etc
 

DCharlie

And even i am moderately surprised
the biggest thing that sticks with me at the moment (other than calling some one dick face , then having them call me dickface back twice, which was pretty useless) is that Square must be thinking "... err... what the fuck?"

Well done MS! get Square at least on board, then fragment the userbase!

One thing today proves - whoever is running the show at MS is so out of touch with what they need to do that they are making it very difficult for anyone to take them seriously.

Seriously, i think they'd be hard pressed to get any random poster on this board to come up with worse ideas!

$399 full pack for 6 months until the PS3 launches and then drop it to $299? Whats the point??? ONE SKU at $299 from the off - swallow 6 months extra loss (because contrary to popular belief , the share price won't move significantly + it would yeild a much better possition in the console market). Clueless to the end - at this point in time they deserve a good slapping.

MS:
I am available for hire - i live in Japan - and i can HELP YOU.
Seriously, how much WORSE can it be for you?
 

Jeff-DSA

Member
HokieJoe said:
I wonder if my current (wired) Live headset work with the 360? Hopefully it will. Aside from that, I don’t need an Ethernet cable, wireless controller, wireless NA, or media remote. I’ll probably just get the core package; and buy a bigger HD, the Component HDAV cable (unless I have an A10, then I’ll get the VGA cable).

Provided that a higher capacity HDD is available, and my old headset will work, my piecemeal approach should give me exactly what I want for less than $399 or whatever the USD estimate is.

I thought it was announced that current accessories would not work with the 360. Is that correct or am I misleading?
 

kenta

Has no PEINS
DopeyFish said:
look at the picture.

RGB component is 3, sound is 2. There are 6 RCA cables indicated in that picture.

Last one has to be composite video.
Oh I didn't realize you were talking specifically about Microsoft's cable, sorry.
 
DCharlie said:
the biggest thing that sticks with me at the moment (other than calling some one dick face , then having them call me dickface back twice, which was pretty useless) is that Square must be thinking "... err... what the fuck?"

Actually was laughing that you would use the phrase dickface...like you know a 8th grader.

Continue on.
 

DopeyFish

Not bitter, just unsweetened
DCharlie said:
the biggest thing that sticks with me at the moment (other than calling some one dick face , then having them call me dickface back twice, which was pretty useless) is that Square must be thinking "... err... what the fuck?"

Well done MS! get Square at least on board, then fragment the userbase!

One thing today proves - whoever is running the show at MS is so out of touch with what they need to do that they are making it very difficult for anyone to take them seriously.

Seriously, i think they'd be hard pressed to get any random poster on this board to come up with worse ideas!

$399 full pack for 6 months until the PS3 launches and then drop it to $299? Whats the point??? ONE SKU at $299 from the off - swallow 6 months extra loss (because contrary to popular belief , the share price won't move significantly + it would yeild a much better possition in the console market). Clueless to the end - at this point in time they deserve a good slapping.

MS:
I am available for hire - i live in Japan - and i can HELP YOU.
Seriously, how much WORSE can it be for you?

not one game can support the hard drive as a primary function. Games must work without the hard drive no matter what. You can optimise a game for the hard drive if it's attached.

Considering this was in the basic specs as of... oh... over a year ago....

a) Square isn't going "oh shit!" because their game won't require an install this time.

b) it's not fracturing the userbase. All games will be played as normal without a hard drive. increased loadtimes will result with a bunch of games if you have one.

that is all.
 

Yusaku

Member
Stinkles said:
Are you controlling games with your Universal remote? Sweet.

No, but only because I didn't bother mapping the necessary buttons. I should probably do that, play FF7 one-handed.
 
DCharlie said:
$399 full pack for 6 months until the PS3 launches and then drop it to $299? Whats the point??? ONE SKU at $299 from the off - swallow 6 months extra loss (because contrary to popular belief , the share price won't move significantly + it would yeild a much better possition in the console market). Clueless to the end - at this point in time they deserve a good slapping.


yep agreed ....i was gonna buy x360 for sure, but after today i think i will just wait till ps3 come and the 360 drops in price.
 
Base package is flatly disappointing, but OTOH the $400 pack is better than expected, truly packed.

But just as PS2 and GC were always actually $20+ more because of the need for memory cards, so now the base Xbox 360 is actually $340. Really, the base package seems so weak that perhaps they are deliberately pulling a Honda-like DX/LX contrast. That is, no one goes for the low-price DX models when they see the LX has everything they want..or actually expect...

Similarly, that $400 package is actually quite good value, similar to how the PSP with Spidey and extras was good value.

But it is still $400. :/
 

DopeyFish

Not bitter, just unsweetened
Jeff-DSA said:
I thought it was announced that current accessories would not work with the 360. Is that correct or am I misleading?

Live headset will work. Video cables from xbox won't work (different connecter)
 

Amir0x

Banned
So, hey...wow...this is awkward, huh!

I wouldn't mind the 399.99 price at all. As I said before, I'm HAPPY someone is doing it. This game of chicken can not go on forever with inflation. This guarantees at least a 399.99 PS3 (which will be like 399.99 360, except w/out HD correct? So technically, the 360 still wins there)

But the bad thing is making another SKU that doesn't have HD, and on top of that pricing the peripherals at ridiculous heights. Segmenting your userbase - and no matter what bullshit people try to suggest, that's exactly what this is - and losing the required HD for it is a disaster. That was a huge advantage for 360, I said as much. I was so pissed PS3 didn't have a HD standard, at least 360 would! But now we can't even rely on that. I knew developers weren't supposed to either way, but it was a comfort factor that ya know... it was still there. At least for now. Bethesda said Oblivion won't go to PS3 because it doesn't have HDD standard. This is something that has no meaning anymore.

I just don't know. What a week, eh? Zelda delay, Micro 100, Xbox360 299/399 one w/out HD. All to the world's ending, or at least until PS3 price makes another 30 page thread.

Oh, and Dopey, you are a mouth piece for Microsoft and nobody takes you seriously.
 

Elios83

Member
DCharlie said:
the biggest thing that sticks with me at the moment (other than calling some one dick face , then having them call me dickface back twice, which was pretty useless) is that Square must be thinking "... err... what the fuck?"

Well done MS! get Square at least on board, then fragment the userbase!

One thing today proves - whoever is running the show at MS is so out of touch with what they need to do that they are making it very difficult for anyone to take them seriously.

Seriously, i think they'd be hard pressed to get any random poster on this board to come up with worse ideas!

$399 full pack for 6 months until the PS3 launches and then drop it to $299? Whats the point??? ONE SKU at $299 from the off - swallow 6 months extra loss (because contrary to popular belief , the share price won't move significantly + it would yeild a much better possition in the console market). Clueless to the end - at this point in time they deserve a good slapping.

MS:
I am available for hire - i live in Japan - and i can HELP YOU.
Seriously, how much WORSE can it be for you?


In fact,I suspect that Microsoft convinced Square that Xbox360 would be a stable and ideal platform for their online games thanks to the standard hard disk.
FFXI producer said he wasn't sure to bring FFXI on PS3 without the hard disk as a standard for example.
And now.....they must feel deceived.
 

Nerevar

they call me "Man Gravy".
Vark said:
2) Yes, I absolutely do. Because people will see a 50 dollar controll and a 100 dollar HDD add on and say 'well for just 100 I get both in the 'value' pack'.

I don't know, I really disagree with you there. I think most people will buy the cheaper version because, as numerous studies have shown, people value the price of electronics more than any other factor. And now that the HDD is essentially an optional feature, they'll ask why they even need it in the first place. This is especially true of parents buying the system for their kids (which, despite all the talk about expanding the industry, is still an extremely large chunk of all console sales).

As I said, I'd be much more receptive if it was just 1, high price point without the ass-raping on accessories. I might be in the minority on that, but the current price structure only emphasizes how much they're ripping you off on the components / accessories.
 

Gattsu25

Banned
DopeyFish said:
a) Square isn't going "oh shit!" because their game won't require an install this time.

b) it's not fracturing the userbase. All games will be played as normal without a hard drive. increased loadtimes will result with a bunch of games if you have one.
How will that work? Surely you know how much Squeenix loves making users see that POL update screen?
 

Drakken

Member
I'm sure someone's mentioned this before, but I was just thinking how it's funny that the minimum you could spend on the Xbox 360 is $360 (give or take a few bucks depending on the tax rate of course).

$300 + $40 (necessary mem. card) + $20 tax (6% in NJ) = $360.

Funny, Microsoft. :-/
 
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