mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
It says they're marketing has worked on you. That's all.
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Meta Quest is the PlayStation of the VR era
- Thread starter onQ123
- Start date
It says they're marketing has worked on you. That's all.
Romulus
Member
Kev Kev
Member
Lol jk. PS was legendary but I don't see any VR headset having that title, not yet. With a couple more killer apps and games, it'll be closer, but then some people just don't want to wear the headset. They'll need to get smaller and lighter first. I also believe we will transition out of using so many motion controls. It makes sense and can be fun for some things, like how they use it in Half Life: Alyx, but it shouldn't be everything you do. For example, pumping your arms when you want to sprint in a game
Either way, I'm excited to see where it goes, and see which one truly breaks out with the kind of success that PS had in it's early days.
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Fredrik
Member
Recently?
Nothing except Moss 2, which isn’t really new now.
Back when the excitement was the highest I played a lot, most talked about stuff, beat saber, superhot, moss, the vaders, space pirate, room, some smaller focused vr experiences, etc. I went back in for RE4 but fell out quickly. Moss 2 was there as well, doing that again now. Put some hours into drop dead too which was cool. Hmm trying to remember what else there is. If you have recommendations, post please! Oh I played some ancient dungeon, unfortunately got motion sick fast for some reason, seemed great though. And I’ve used it on PC, lots of Skyrim, No Man’s Sky, Alyx, Flight Sim. I do think SteamVR compatibility is going to be Quest’s biggest strength going forward unless Sony and Apple also step in there. But in the end I still think it’ll be niche, if I can use that word.
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rodrigolfp
Gamepads 4 Life
And several racing games, flight simulator, Skyrim...
Minsc
Member
Yeah, the pumping the arms in Horizon I tried for a few minutes, it made no sense to me other than perhaps a way to help ease in for new VR people then I turned on analog movement and don't miss that one bit. Sure in Beat Saber or whatever using an analog stick wouldn't work as well, but as long as you have options that's great.
Lol jk. PS was legendary but I don't see any VR headset having that title, not yet. With a couple more killer apps and games, it'll be closer, but then some people just don't want to wear the headset. They'll need to get smaller and lighter first. I also believe we will transition out of using so many motion controls. It makes sense and can be fun for some things, like how they use it in Half Life: Alyx, but it shouldn't be everything you do. For example, pumping your arms when you want to sprint in a game
Did you need to pump arms in Alyx to move around? That sounds hard to believe given how loved it is or where you referring to another popular game?
Kev Kev
Member
I've never played Alyx but from the videos I've seen it appears to be minimal hand/arm movement while looking interesting and fluid. But still, I really prefer not requiring motion controls at all, so if given the option I wouldn't use them.
Romulus
Member
Asgard's Wrath, Stormland, HL2 mod(equal to Alyx for me) Elite Dangerous, Project Wingman, RE2,3 and 8 mod are fantastic. Iracing. Tales from the Galaxy edge is superior to Vader Immortal. Outer Wilds and Firewatch are both great. On Quest 2 native, into the Radius and Lies Beneath are a couple of gems. Team Beef has fantastic native quest ports of Doom 3, Jedi Outcast(full motion control force powers and saber) Wolf, and several more. The OG Doom ports are the definitive version of the games IMO, it's just so well done with Brutal Doom add ons.
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lukilladog
Member
Vr gaming is on life support now. From twitch numbers, I'm pretty certain that this has been the worst launch ever for a Sony Franchise (Horizon) and the worst selling peripheral... and PC/Quest vr is surviving on comunity mods (Beardo youtuber said it himself).
Fredrik
Member
Thanks I’ll look into some of those
I have Elite Dangerous, not sure I would be able to handle it without motion sickness though, had issues with No Man’s Sky. RE2,3, do they have 1st person VR mods or is it a 3rd person VR mod?
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Mibu no ookami
Member
I think OP ignores Sony's inherent advantage over pretty much any other competitor when it comes to VR.
First off they make their own AAA games but also have relationships with other publishers who put out AAA games.
The ability to add a VR mode to an already existing VR game is going to be significantly cheaper and less risky than building a AAA stand-alone VR title.
Since Meta doesn't have a stand-alone platform, they're not going to be able to absorb this the same way. In this sense Valve has an upperhand, but their games don't drive Steam sales like Sony games drive PlayStation sales.
Think Sony is in a unique position to drive VR.
First off they make their own AAA games but also have relationships with other publishers who put out AAA games.
The ability to add a VR mode to an already existing VR game is going to be significantly cheaper and less risky than building a AAA stand-alone VR title.
Since Meta doesn't have a stand-alone platform, they're not going to be able to absorb this the same way. In this sense Valve has an upperhand, but their games don't drive Steam sales like Sony games drive PlayStation sales.
Think Sony is in a unique position to drive VR.
Mibu no ookami
Member
Is PSVR2 selling worse than PSVR1?
What were the PSVR1 launch titles? Are you comparing Horizon sales to these games or Sony 1st party flat games? Pretty obvious that you're disingenuous here..
Fredrik
Member
Problem for Sony is that they’re selling a pheripheral and not a complete VR setup like Meta. In my country it’s a $1400 investment if you don’t have a PS5. Their walled-garden approach isn’t helping either, if they unlock it for PC and SteamVR it would increase the potential userbase a bit.
lukilladog
Member
Yes I would guess.
I don't think there are any sales numbers to compare. I cannot pull any twitch data from 2016 but I remember that lots of people were trying the thing, and you would think that fans of the Horizon and GT franchises would be very interested on watching how they are on VR but that doesn't seem to be the case. GT7 peak numbers dropped from 3k in January to 2.7k in February and the average remains the same, so the GT7 VR mode introduction made no difference in the interest of viewers. Horizon call of the mountain is doing far worse numbers than any other horizon game ATM despite being on newly released technology.
https://twitchtracker.com/games/1575120516
https://twitchtracker.com/games/490374
https://twitchtracker.com/games/518015
For reference Alyx on PC peaked at 300k 3 years ago but it seems that Valve has abandoned VR now, so I think that PSVR2 is dead on arrival.
bluecowboys
Member
VR and Gaming won't be main stream. However, there are other applications that can make it main stream.
Mibu no ookami
Member
I mean, I think you'd have a point if it wasn't for the fact that the PS5 has a good chance to be a top 5 all-time selling console... That being said, I do think they need to open up to PC.
You have to look at what the break-even point is for Sony on this and I'd expect that it isn't that high.
Mibu no ookami
Member
You've literally made up everything you've said.
You would guess?
twitch numbers?
Did anyone think that a VR horizon that can only be played on psvr2 was going to sell as well as console horizon games with much larger userbases? That's patently ridiculous.
How many platforms/devices support playing half life alyx? but yes, let's compare it to a launch title on a peripheral that just launched... you're not even trying here...
Romulus
Member
I've told you this several times but streaming VR is a ridiculous concept. You have almost no idea what the user is seeing in VR. 2d streaming works because it's an actual representation.
And it's funny you say valve has abandoned VR when they're working on another headset. Lol
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Fredrik
Member
100 mil PS5 or not, they’re asking people to buy a fairly expensive peripheral for a closed platform. Getting mainstream appeal will be a struggle.
Mibu no ookami
Member
1) PS5 is going to sell more than 100m units, but nice try on the short change there, didn't go unnoticed though
2) This is the launch of the unit, it's not going to be 550 forever. Sony at one point had a 200-dollar PSVR bundle going and this was less than 2 years after launch.
3) I don't think you know what the goals are for the PSVR2. I think your definition vs what it would take to break even or profit from the endeavour are two different things.
Buggy Loop
Member
I want Valve to announce Deckard headset + Half Life 3 VR exclusive just for the meltdowns.
DaGwaphics
Member
Is that all, they should have done that yesterday.
Seriously though, hopefully Sony will invest in full scale quality content. The smaller, tech-demo like VR experiences are specifically the ones that can impress when VR is new but get old rather fast once the initial thrill wears off.
Games with the detail level to really transport you places are the ones that will remain interesting even once you adjust to VR. UE5 should help too, with the way it allows so much detail.
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Justin9mm
Member
Quest 2 as a standalone is never going to have AAA games like PSVR2 due to hardware limitation, you are right, it does feel like the Wii as far as the type of games and graphics it can run. PSVR2 is really competing with PCVR not Quest imo. The advantage that Quest 2 has is that it is PCVR capable and playing those high fidelity PCVR games wirelessly. Since building a new PC and using my Quest 2 for PCVR, I will never go back to playing native Quest 2 games, it's a night and day difference. If the PSVR2 could also be capable of PCVR, it would kill the Quest.
DaGwaphics
Member
You should be able to do wireless and use a powerful PC/Console. Quest can already do that with airlink and that and similar tech will continue to improve over time.
Crayon
Member
We need to get a little farther along in hardware for a playstation of vr. Quest 2 sells really well but ps1 had a steady procession of must have games from beginning to end. The tech baseline will be raised with quest 3 and psvr2 will be an interesting experiment to see if sony can make waves with any first party releases that are up to that GT7/RE8/Horizon standard of graphics. Then we'll see if psvr2 and deckard can boost interest in hi-end enough for any games to skip quest 3 and go for that higher bar.
That's the software side. Hardware has to come a little farther, too. That tiny headset from big screen is the first I've seen that has the low size and weight to make a leap in comfort. Then we need dedicated wireless solutions (not people's comcast routers) with the throughput of a displayport cable, standard eye tracking, and prices like 299 console and 399 standalone. All that will get us to where the hardware itself is not a big hurdle to adoption.
If all that goes well, we might get the playstatoin of vr that sells alot, builds a library with some truly impressive games for everyone, and actually makes money.
That's the software side. Hardware has to come a little farther, too. That tiny headset from big screen is the first I've seen that has the low size and weight to make a leap in comfort. Then we need dedicated wireless solutions (not people's comcast routers) with the throughput of a displayport cable, standard eye tracking, and prices like 299 console and 399 standalone. All that will get us to where the hardware itself is not a big hurdle to adoption.
If all that goes well, we might get the playstatoin of vr that sells alot, builds a library with some truly impressive games for everyone, and actually makes money.
Absolutely, it has its purpose, new stadiums are using it to sell season tickets and hospitality boxes etc, architecture and medical training etc etc, but in terms of consuming any form of entertainment it will never be mainstream.
midnightAI
Member
As I said, how many AAA that are not modded to work in VR, in other words had VR in mind while the game was being made. My point was not many AAA games on PC have been developed, not even hybrid games.
For racing games adding the VR mode afterwards has worked well (such as AC), but Skyrim VR is horrible.
GT Sport on PSVR wasn't a great experience as it was just patched in afterwards, whereas GT7 had VR developed at the same time as the flat version.
(Also, MS flight sim in VR is a mod is it not?)
DenchDeckard
Member
Psvr 2 must be selling worse than psvr 1 launch aligned right, just down to the fact that it's only available from sony directly in most places outside of the US?
Maybe I'm wrong though.
Can't buy it from places like amazon, or retail in general in the UK.
Maybe I'm wrong though.
Can't buy it from places like amazon, or retail in general in the UK.
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Fredrik
Member
It’s available everywhere in Sweden, but at $700 so I doubt it’s selling much, I don’t know anyone who bought it.
rofif
Member
725$ for horizon bundle in Poland.... that's like... whole month of salary for many people here lol.
It is everywhere in stock. It's the only electronic that's in stock
Resenge
Member
Dude has the same old tired arguments from years ago. He has a real hate boner for VR.
rodrigolfp
Gamepads 4 Life
ah yes. Only AAA counts, mods don't count, Skyrim is horrible, bla bla bla. And MS FS is oficial, yes.
Lunarorbit
Member
Errr... OK.
I'm excited to buy a psvr2. I never want to give Facebook any money or any more of my data.
One is a electronics/game company and the other is data harvesting sketchiness wrapped up like its an entertainment experience.
I'm excited to buy a psvr2. I never want to give Facebook any money or any more of my data.
One is a electronics/game company and the other is data harvesting sketchiness wrapped up like its an entertainment experience.
midnightAI
Member
Now you get it, well done.
(My point still stands, how many AAA PC games have been developed with VR in mind, the answer... Not many. This isn't PC versus PlayStation, this is the state of VR games in general, but at least Sony is going to attempt to change that if they keep their word on hybrid games)
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DenchDeckard
Member
Wow! $725 and that's retail pricing, not scalping?
rofif
Member
Normal media markt pricing. Cheapset there is with horizon bundle... Every retailer got the same price. No scalping since it is plentiful
...so you might imagine why I am returning mine since I dont find it comfortable and poor optics.
rodrigolfp
Gamepads 4 Life
Non AAA games and mods are games too. if you only care about AAA, your loss.
rofif
Member
Small games are the king of vr. No one doubts that. Would just hope there is more alyx than 1
midnightAI
Member
I don't think you understand what I am saying. I am saying that the VR games industry needs to change, it needs to get away from short, cheap looking, experimental VR games and make proper AAA type VR games. Unfortunately stand alone VR in its current form cannot handle those types of games and so standalone VR (in my opinion) is holding back VR game development. However, it is the future of VR but only when it can produce much higher quality games.
rodrigolfp
Gamepads 4 Life
Agreed, but what I first quoted was you saying about the Quest being able only to be used for wireless mobile games. The device doesn't need to change to receive AAA games. If you are hopping for it receiving "AAA looking" games standalone, very good luck putting a 200W PS5 like APU using a battery on a tiny hot device on your face.
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Romulus
Member
There were a few exceptions. This game absolutely blew my mind for its capabilities for native Quest 2. It even had RT. It looked like something that should be running on a 1060ti at least, not mobile.
Justin9mm
Member
I looked at this game but the average and small amount of combat put me off especially at the price it is right now on the Quest store. But yeah I would assume this is one of the best production quality native run Quest 2 games.