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Square Enix: Forspoken Sales Were Lackluster, Many Small and Mid Games Underperformed

feynoob

Member
Again, show me where one of these things has a direct impact on the other. They are not related initiatives.
That money could be used on improving their games. Instead it went to the wrong investment.

They could have hired better writers and keep an eye on their studios.
 
I keep hearing how Forspoken flopped yet I’ve seen no movement on the price. Square needs to swallow their pride and send this to the clearance rack ASAP.
id buy that for a dollar GIF
 

ProtoByte

Member
You guys argue constantly that retail is the only healthy future of the medium, that Sony gamers like paying for their games, that Sony helps with development, that Sony helps with marketing. Well this game didn't turn out well. Now you argue it should be on Gamepass.
The thing you're missing with this strawman is that the games have to be good.
This game didn't turn out well, and it wasn't exclusive to PS5 anyway. It launched on PC too.
FF7R was actually exclusive to PS4, and it did turn out well. Because the game is good. The same will most likely occur as it pertains to FF16.
 
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Labadal

Member
Imo, the releases of their smaller games were totally mismanaged. There is nothing wrong with making games like Diofield, Harvestella, and more. Neither is making remakes. pricing was also a biyt off. These kinds of games should be released in between big releases, like for example, you release FFXVI, and then the schedule is empty for some months. In this case, let us assume that FFXVI turns out good. THAT is the time to capitalize on momentum and release smaller games, until your next big thing is coming up, in my example case FFVIIR2. Release more smaller games, and so on.

They just released, low budget game after low budget game. Star Ocean 6 was made on a shoestring budget. Romancing SaGa Remaster (a game I love) is a niche game, Diofield is decent, harvestella is supposed to be good. Stranger of Paradise is certainly a game that could have benefited to release before XVI, and maybe have a demo included. There are many things that could have been done, but to rely solely on "smaller" games released in such a short time span isn't really feasible, which they learned the hard way.
 

RickMasters

Member
Should have been on Gamepass.
Well...they wanted to focus on their main platform to optimise the quality of the game.... Companies need to stop using that excuse only to end up turning out a dud...and apparently there aint enough of us xbox gamers playing their games (I own lots or sqareenix games in my backlog, but Im just one guy) I might have tried this out on GP, but based on the reviews Im glad they never wasted our time with this one. Still holding out for a port of octopath traveller 2. I loved the first game. and that FF pixel remaster would complete my FF collection on xbox.
 

CamHostage

Member
It's disappointing to hear titles like Diofield, Harvestella, and Tactics Ogre likely underperformed, but they all launched literally a couple of weeks apart at full price and not too much marketing, so I'm not sure what they expected.

Hopefully Octopath II and Theatrhythm end up performing better in the long run.

That's what I'm more worried about in the future of Square Enix. Having a swing-and-a-miss on an original mainstream title happens for big companies, usually they just keep making them (and lean in on the cornerstone franchises when original titles don't hit) until something hits or it all goes wrong. These little games, though, they need to work to keep coming. Square Enix taking chances and experimenting outside of the FF/DQ brands is something I have wanted for a long time, but if they continue to fail, they'll not do these again.

I can't say that the strategy of releases or design has really been the needed formula to support these games, so the failures are not outside of understanding. (And if Square no longer has the ability to find/cultivate JRPG fans like it did in its stronger days, is there really a success to wish for?) However, I appreciate these boutique efforts, particularly the Final Fantasy & Dragons Quest series shift away from their traditional gameplay styles to court mainstream audiences.
 
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YukiOnna

Member
That's what I'm more worried about in the future of Square Enix. Having a swing-and-a-miss on an original title happens for big companies, usually they just keep making them (and lean in on the cornerstone franchises when original titles don't hit) until something hits or it all goes wrong, but these little games need to work to keep coming. Square Enix taking chances and experimenting outside of the FF/DQ brands is something I have wanted for a long time, but if they continue to fail, they'll not do these again.
And it took a while to get back to that after these kinds of titles were pretty much missing under late Yoichi Wada era and instead getting those weird globalization titles. It's almost criminal how little exposure TWEWY 2 got, Steam release was the definition of a sleeper release. I hope it doesn't go back to just FF, DQ, KH spin-offs and they actually evaluate how they release and market these titles. Bravely Default team/Team Asano is a reliable brand and team that release good stuff, for example, would suck to lose that.
 

mckmas8808

Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
So all those investments in NFTs didn't make millions in profits? Who could have guessed...


It kinda seems like all the new ways to make money for people have just BOMBED over the last 2 years.

- Crypto
- NFTs
- GAAS
 
First of all, 69?

Noice Thats Nice GIF


Secondly, Tri-Ace announced later after 6’s release that they were hiring, so clearly the game must have sold enough to help them out as from what I understand they had been struggling before 6 came out.

They need to reboot the franchise and put some actual resources into it.

They should do it with most of their franchises. Build off of those reboots.

Give up their obsession with FF7 (one of my favorite games mind you)
 
I think part of the problem with Square's games having sales issues is due to them being pigeon holed as JRPG makers. Probably better if management just accepts it and guns for FF, DQ, Octopath and whatever other traditional games they make.

Doing all these indie budget card games, Forspoken, Balan, Babylons Fall, Avengers, GOTG etc.... arent the types they are known for. It also doesn't help that many get lousy reviews too. I dont think sales of any of these games are great. Look at all the money they spent on these games.

I totally get they are trying to expand their portfolio with all kinds of games, including GAAS, and upcoming Blockchain based games, but sometimes you just to focus on what you're good at.

A lot of game companies now have consolidated their portfolio to make games within a narrow focus. Ya, you got EA making all kinds of games, Embracer or that THQ group with a shit load of studios making different stuff etc... but if you dont have the talent or expertise, dont spread thin on games.
 
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John Wick

Member
Considering that you're straight up trolling and there's a mod commenting like 2 posts above you, maybe knock it off. Has literally nothing to do with the thread. You guys argue constantly that retail is the only healthy future of the medium, that Sony gamers like paying for their games, that Sony helps with development, that Sony helps with marketing. Well this game didn't turn out well. Now you argue it should be on Gamepass. Why are you bringing this up?
Where are you getting this game was part developed by Sony? This game was developed by LS and marketed by SE.
Yeah this game will go on Sony's PS plus service.
 
I dont know how good or bad their finances are, but the temptation is too great for GAAS and now upcoming blockchain games. Looks like they'll keep gunning for it till they find a successful game.

Like all game companies, they see the giant revenue streams from GAAS and mtx, so might as well jump on the train.

No doubt they have detailed industry info about all the $$$ COD, Fortnite, GTAV online etc.... So got to carve out a slice of that pie too.
 
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I bought Diofield and Tactics Ogre day 1, Forspoken demo convinced me not to pick it up, will play it if it comes to PS+ *maybe*. FF16 will be a monster, they need to officially announce FF Tactics remaster, FFVII games will pull in lots of $$$.

I will say I appreciate Square putting out myriad games and providing demos for most of them.
 

CatLady

Selfishly plays on Xbox Purr-ies X
well with that kind of quality it's unsurprising...square really needs to put their shit together...and they even sold their best studios fairly recently
Square is a mess. They basically gave away their 2 best studios and great IPs for next to nothing. I have NO interest in anything from Square Enix these days.

I wish Xbox hadn't been screwing around with ABK and got Crystal Dynamics and Eidos Montreal instead.
 

kiphalfton

Member
Crappy games should underperform.

If they don't, then it reinforces that devs can release subpar games and get away with it.
 

xrnzaaas

Member
Sucks for Tactics Ogre and other genuinely good games. Forspoken should be a lesson for them how NOT to make a new IP.

By the way, were they ever publicly satisfied with the sales? Something tells me they're going to moan about FF16 and FF7-2 underperforming as well.
 
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BennyBlanco

aka IMurRIVAL69
I bought Tactics Ogre and Octopath 2. Their AA stuff has been way better and more interesting than their AAA tentpole releases to me. I have hope for FFXVI but I could easily see that being a shitshow as well.
 

BennyBlanco

aka IMurRIVAL69
Square is a mess. They basically gave away their 2 best studios and great IPs for next to nothing. I have NO interest in anything from Square Enix these days.

I wish Xbox hadn't been screwing around with ABK and got Crystal Dynamics and Eidos Montreal instead.

Not to mention IO who might be the best devs out of anyone mentioned in this thread. Hitman trilogy is a legit modern masterpiece.
 

MagiusNecros

Gilgamesh Fan Annoyance
Might be better if they stuck to AA games that have engaging gameplay and story as opposed to AAA garbage? I have no doubt that FFVII-2 Part 2 and FFXVI: Asura's Wrath will do great but beyond that I don't think they can make million dollar budget games that will sell. Bigger isn't better.

I'm sure the woke pandering and obnoxious system specs wasn't doing itself any favors. Game was sent out to die at the firing range.
 
Forspoken was cursed, every new showing turned worse than the one before it, the character is a girl with "the attitude" that curses a lot because writers can't do scripts without the awful wedonesque dialogue and edgy curse words because "we mature yo"

The settings, the character and the dialogue couldn't clash in the worse possible way, it'd be like watching a fantasy movie where the main character is a Duke Nukem copy/paste and the script is made by reeeeee users

As for the AA games don't doing good, well what do you expect, releasing one after the other with no room to breathe and with 0 push...
If Whedon had written Forspoken, it would have a much better story than this trash.
 
Square is a mess. They basically gave away their 2 best studios and great IPs for next to nothing. I have NO interest in anything from Square Enix these days.

I wish Xbox hadn't been screwing around with ABK and got Crystal Dynamics and Eidos Montreal instead.
No, no they didn’t. The FF7 team, the DQ team and CBU3 are far and away their best teams. They sold off the American studios nobody cared about. Crystal Dynamics has done nothing good, nor has luminous. Im surprised they sold Tomb Raider, but whatever.

The strength of SE has always been their Japanese arm.
 

Azurro

Member
It’s hard to tell with Square Enix because they want every game to sell 10+ million and if they sell 8M they’ll say it’s utter failure and disappointment.

As far as I remember, almost all of those really high sales expectations came from Eidos titles, Tomb Raider, Avengers and such. Could be the reason why they got rid of them, they were probably too expensive for the revenue they were producing.
 

Arsic

Member
I bought it. It sucked.

I also got octopath 2, bravely default 2, triangle strategy ; and all of those were/are bangers.

I got star ocean and Valkyrie Elysium which are far worse than foreskinspoken .
 

NeoIkaruGAF

Member
I think part of the problem with Square's games having sales issues is due to them being pigeon holed as JRPG makers. Probably better if management just accepts it and guns for FF, DQ, Octopath and whatever other traditional games they make.

Doing all these indie budget card games, Forspoken, Balan, Babylons Fall, Avengers, GOTG etc.... arent the types they are known for. It also doesn't help that many get lousy reviews too. I dont think sales of any of these games are great. Look at all the money they spent on these games.

I totally get they are trying to expand their portfolio with all kinds of games, including GAAS, and upcoming Blockchain based games, but sometimes you just to focus on what you're good at.

A lot of game companies now have consolidated their portfolio to make games within a narrow focus. Ya, you got EA making all kinds of games, Embracer or that THQ group with a shit load of studios making different stuff etc... but if you dont have the talent or expertise, dont spread thin on games.
It’s kind of a series of self-fulfilling prophecies for SE at this point.
They do a lot of RPGs still. BUT, people only really want FF and KH from them, so that’s where the big money goes. The rest of their games have to do with limited tech and budgets and virtually zero marketing, of course nobody knows about them. Plus, the smaller games aren’t what people expect from SE, so they review poorly and people are all too eager to call them trash even without having played them.

I hope SE keep diversifying their portfolio. Otherwise we wouldn’t even have the good smaller stuff like Octopath or Teatrhythm and we’d be stuck with FF (far from its highs at this point), the joke that KH has become, and their west-pandering shit. The industry needs a big publisher doing smaller stuff. The quality you get from a B-tier SE game is still netter than what you get from indies on average.
 
I was under the impression that Tactics Ogre was at least a modest success. There is nothing to suggest that it is one of the games that underperformed.
I'm hoping that Front Mission 1st was a modest success. That should be ported to PC and other consoles.
 

lyan

Member
Imo, the releases of their smaller games were totally mismanaged. There is nothing wrong with making games like Diofield, Harvestella, and more. Neither is making remakes. pricing was also a biyt off. These kinds of games should be released in between big releases, like for example, you release FFXVI, and then the schedule is empty for some months. In this case, let us assume that FFXVI turns out good. THAT is the time to capitalize on momentum and release smaller games, until your next big thing is coming up, in my example case FFVIIR2. Release more smaller games, and so on.

They just released, low budget game after low budget game. Star Ocean 6 was made on a shoestring budget. Romancing SaGa Remaster (a game I love) is a niche game, Diofield is decent, harvestella is supposed to be good. Stranger of Paradise is certainly a game that could have benefited to release before XVI, and maybe have a demo included. There are many things that could have been done, but to rely solely on "smaller" games released in such a short time span isn't really feasible, which they learned the hard way.
The release window mess is probably because most of these smaller titles are not developed by their own teams and some needed more time. Then for reasons like cash flow they got released altogether.
 

Labadal

Member
The release window mess is probably because most of these smaller titles are not developed by their own teams and some needed more time. Then for reasons like cash flow they got released altogether.
Probably, but it causes fatigue with players.

They released 35+ games in 26 months.

I got 12 of those titles. I may get up to 6 more of those. There isn't time for all of their stuff.
 
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