Support NeoGAF

[ultim8p00]

There are other people with supposedly reliable sources. He said the same thing they said. Lose network connection, no gaming.

HE did not say THAT. That's what I'm saying. Other rumors may have said it, and I've certainly seen some that have. But he did not say that at all in his comment. Pretty much what he said was "it will work offline" but we don't actually know what that means exactly. He didn't say that if there is no connection you can't play games.

Jesus. This isn't difficult.

On the podcast there is no ambiguity. He says: "must be internet connected to use"

But on here he says "it will work offline"

From both of those, the only thing we can logically conclude is that there is some offline functionality, but there is some functionality that requires online functionality. We don't know anything else.

 

[Mifune]

If you believe this guy (and you probably should), there will be NO offline functionality for games or apps. He words it weirdly but that's what he's saying.

I feel like this is the new console paradigm but Microsoft is forcing it too early.

 

[SlickShoesRUCrazy]

Ya'll do notice that he said nothing about online drm right?

Nor did he say being always online was mandatory. Sounded more like he was touting it like a feature similar to the ps4.

/raises flameshield

 

[BruiserBear]

This story is so awesome on so many levels. Just seeing people's reactions is entertaining. Especially those who were so sure it wasn't true over the past few months.

As much as my interest in the next Xbox has lessened, my interest in seeing them officially unveil it has grown, if only to see how they spin the decision as a good thing, when in fact every single reason they're doing this is related to obnoxious levels of greed and controlling their customers.

Remember folks, you're no longer going to own your games. Microsoft will decide when and how you can play that game, forever. You want to fire up that copy of Halo 5 a decade from now, you'd better hope Microsoft's servers are working, or you're not allowed to play that game you paid for. 20 years from now? lol, good luck with that.

It'll be like EA's server bullshit except now it'll apply to even your single player games.

 

[Forsythia]

It can't be May soon enough. It still isn't clear if games can be played offline, which is the main issue.

 

[ChosenPredator]

so what does this mean are people here assuming you have to be online all the time to play games? which is ultra stupid I can't see any company ever doing that unless the publisher said it's an always online game.

Or is it the actual console is always online since it's most likely going to be always connected like some people have their current consoles, if that is the case it's not so bad.


which is it?

 

[Sullichin]

You'd think Microsoft would want to maybe clear this up instead of waiting until late May to say anything about it.

 

[ultim8p00]

If you believe this guy (and you probably should), there will be NO offline functionality for games or apps. He words it weirdly but that's what he's saying.

I feel like this is the new console paradigm but Microsoft is forcing it too early.

Show me where he says that. Did I miss something?

so what does this mean are people here assuming you have to be online all the time to play games? which is ultra stupid I can't see any company ever doing that unless the publisher said it's an always online game.

Or is it the actual console is always online since it's most likely going to be always connected like some people have their current consoles, if that is the case it's not so bad.


which is it?

Answer: We don't know.

 

[BlazingDarkness]

The casuals already bought a Wii, this people will never going to buy consoles again. There's a reason WiiU is failing.

Kinect 2.0 is probably going to be what Kinect originally promised to be, the WiiU Gamepad is nothing like what the Wii originally offered, the two situations aren't really comparable IMO. Plus MS will actually market the thing, haven't seen a Wii U advert in the UK since before Christmas.

 

[McHuj]

IMO, the problem with always online isn't the user's internet connection. Even in rural areas, it should be good enough for 99% of the time.

The problem with always-on and more specifically online authentication for single player games is on the server side. Let's repeat Sim City launch with a Halo 4/Gears3 launch server load. No one gets to play regardless of how good your internet connection will be.

 

[Barkley's Justice]

Isnt the Xbox already always online when you play?

Sure, there's no restriction (as far as I know?) preventing you from playing games offline. But who here ever plays Xbox or PS3 offline?

No seriously, when are you not logged into Live or PSN?

 

[Flatline]

Ya'll do notice that he said nothing about online drm right?

Nor did he say being always online was mandatory. Sounded more like he was touting it like a feature similar to the ps4.

/raises flameshield

Either he's extremely stupid and he doesn't understand what the whole internet is complaining about or he's talking about what everyone else is, which is online DRM.

Choose one.

 

[gofreak]

Nor did he say being always online was mandatory.

Well, he does say that he was told it is required - "the next Xbox is going to require an always-on Internet connection"

Required, mandatory...

Beyond that, he says he doesn't know the specifics of how it'll work.

 

[Sorian]

You'd think Microsoft would want to maybe clear this up instead of waiting until late May to say anything about it.

PR spins are hard to come up with, give them some time!

 

[FordGTGuy]

Too late, bro. Paul has spoken.

Paul has information we do not have yet.

I'm with you Enzo, I don't think this guy has any clue as to what he's talking about, or what always-online means for gamers.

If anyone has any clue about future Microsoft products it would be Paul.

For those who don't who Paul Thurott is he a journalist covering MS and technology. He has great sources and connections and is very accurate. He's basically the MS version of John Gruber, the Apple blogger.

Look at his setup, he's hardly objective, but his ''market'' is MS enthusiasts.

http://winsupersite.com/hardware/what-i-use-march-2013

Very MS heavy.

Apparently you've never actually listened to Paul, he is usually very hard on Microsoft products.

PR spins are hard to come up with, give them some time!

They are not going to confirm or deny a rumor on a unannounced product so you can keep spinning the truth however you want.

 

[JaggedSac]

It's really unfortunate to see some of you talk shit about Paul Thurrott without knowing anything about him or his site. You see his site brand itself as the "supersite for Windows" and automatically go into internet gamer rage mode.

Paul's site has been a great source for Microsoft-related info for years now, one I can go to quite often and get a no-bullshit preview/review on upcoming Microsoft products, namely Windows, Office, etc. No, he isn't a Microsoft shrill, he does honestly tell it like it is. If he doesn't like something in a new Windows release, he'll say it. If he does like something, he'll say it.

He really hits the nail on the head in that article with these bits:

Don't worry, Paul doesn't give two shits about neogaf.

 

[DopeyFish]

There's, of course, benefits for MS.

But in terms of benefits for the customer, I would be curious about an elaboration on c). If we're talking about gifting games, that could be allowed without constant online checks.

The most intriguing part of C is they could do selling or buy backs (likelier)/rentals/lending in an online only environment - no guarantees they will but there's a lot of potential for it.

If its offline and offline? They can do some of it. And in an imperfect way. It would also get rid of the license migration garbage (right now my Xbox marketplace sends to a no longer operational 360, for example)

 

[Pachimari]

Wait, are we talking about an "Always-On" Xbox or an "Always-Online" Xbox?

Don't they mean, that the console have to always be on in order for it to download in the background and do updates to software, much like PlayStation 4 is already said to be doing. But if you don't have an online connection, it simply won't update or download but still function if you are offline, also letting you play your single-player games though without online features as it have been practised this generation?

 

[Sorian]

Isnt the Xbox already always online when you play?

Sure, there's no restriction (as far as I know?) preventing you from playing games offline. But who here ever plays Xbox or PS3 offline?

No seriously, when are you not logged into Live or PSN?

I'm never logged into Live unless I am actively downloading something.

 

[Unspeakable Evil]

?

No seriously, when are you not logged into Live or PSN?

Right now when it's off or when not connected to the Internet.

 

[Krev]

2) He could have been more tactful, but let’s face it, people are way too sensitive online.

3) The biggest issue here, frankly, was the cyberbullying that occurred in the wake of Orth’s comments. Those sensitive people aren’t so sensitive when it comes to other people, that’s for sure. In fact, that’s my exact definition of a bully.

You don't need to be super sensitive to be really fucking pissed off about a device locking you out of your paid content based on your internet connection and the stability of Microsoft's servers.
Orth got pissy and defensive when people made legitimate criticism of his company's strategy, and did so in an incredibly snarky, arrogant way. He invited the backlash.

 

[Barkley's Justice]

I'm never logged into Live unless I am actively downloading something.

Because...?

 

[Sorian]

Don't worry, Paul doesn't give two shits about neogaf.

You're right, it seems like the Reddit crowd knows how to get under his skin more.

Because...?

Because I don't need to be assaulted by ads when I turn on my system.

 

[Flatline]

Right now when it's off or when not connected to the Internet.

My 360 is never connected because I refuse to pay for Live and I hate the ads Microsoft uploads in my 360 without my consent.

 

[enzo_gt]

The casuals already bought a Wii, this people will never going to buy consoles again. There's a reason WiiU is failing.

The same casuals that bought the Kinect in record breaking numbers and made it the fastest selling consumer electronics device ever at the time?

 

[gaming_noob]

You are all too negative. I like to think positve and will take his word that Durango will be 'awesome'. Can't wait for the reveal.

 

[FordGTGuy]

Wait, are we talking about an "Always-On" Xbox or an "Always-Online" Xbox?

Don't they mean, that the console have to always be on in order for it to download in the background and do updates to software, much like PlayStation 4 is already said to be doing. But if you don't have an online connection, it simply won't update or download but still function if you are offline, also letting you play your single-player games though without online features as it have been practised this generation?

Paul said on What The Tech that we really don't know yet but from leaked documents it's leaning towards always-on and not always-online.

 

[WrenchNinja]

Isnt the Xbox already always online when you play?

Sure, there's no restriction (as far as I know?) preventing you from playing games offline. But who here ever plays Xbox or PS3 offline?

No seriously, when are you not logged into Live or PSN?

All the time. My 360 and PS3 are both disconnected.

 

[BruiserBear]

so what does this mean are people here assuming you have to be online all the time to play games? which is ultra stupid I can't see any company ever doing that unless the publisher said it's an always online game.

Or is it the actual console is always online since it's most likely going to be always connected like some people have their current consoles, if that is the case it's not so bad.


which is it?

Your post makes absolutely no sense. If the console is always online, by default that means you have to be online to play your games.

 

[Cidd]

Someone please make a thread explaining what "Always Online DRM" means, It seems many here don't get the importance of this.

Alway On and Always online DRM are two different things people.

 

[Barkley's Justice]

All the time. My 360 and PS3 are both disconnected.

Why exactly?

It's just odd because I'm assuming you're posting from some kind of online-connected device? A computer for example. Which has an always online-enabled connection. I struggle with understanding why, assumedly, you're OK with one device having an always online-enabled connection and not another.

 

[Kill Your Masters]

Show me where he says that. Did I miss something?



Answer: We don't know.

We don't know so hey lets jump to conclusions and turn and spin all what is said into our own facts - pretty much whats going on right now.

Someone please make a thread explaining what "Always Online DRM" means, It seems many here don't get the importance of this.

Alway On and Always online DRM are two different things people.

They are. But which one will MS implement?

Hypothetical question as you don't know, nobody does outside of people with NDA contracts.

 

[Triple U]

Wait, are we talking about an "Always-On" Xbox or an "Always-Online" Xbox?

Don't they mean, that the console have to always be on in order for it to download in the background and do updates to software, much like PlayStation 4 is already said to be doing. But if you don't have an online connection, it simply won't update or download but still function if you are offline, also letting you play your single-player games though without online features as it have been practised this generation?

Going by the kotaku rumor, where most of the controversy stemmed from, the next Xbox requires you to be online to launch a game/app.

 

[Voice of Reason]

I like the 4G chip rumor someone mentioned, this way you're always online even when your modem/router is out.

 

[Glorified G]

Ya'll do notice that he said nothing about online drm right?

Nor did he say being always online was mandatory. Sounded more like he was touting it like a feature similar to the ps4.

/raises flameshield

No one is going to flame you for not knowing how to read.

Folks, the next Xbox is going to require an always-on Internet connection.

 

[benny_a]

But on here he says "it will work offline"

From both of those, the only thing we can logically conclude is that there is some offline functionality, but there is some functionality that requires online functionality. We don't know anything else.

No that's not what he is saying. He explains other Windows 8 devices and tries to explain Microsoft's direction.
Read the paragraph carefully again.

He says it will require an internet-connection to use. There is nothing more to it. No ambiguity except whatever you come to by not reading carefully.

 

[QaaQer]

Microsoft only let's you cancel online if the local state government commands it. Change your address to somewhere in Illinois and you should be able to cancel online. This is just another example of Microsoft's "consumer-centric" approach.

wtf? seriously? that says so much about how MS views their customers.

 

[bill0527]

You'd think Microsoft would want to maybe clear this up instead of waiting until late May to say anything about it.

Sony should do another big hype event before then, reveal a little more info. Go for the jugular before Xboxs launch event.

I believe waiting so long after Sonys announcement is going to be a terrible mistake for Microsoft. Like they have so much confidence in what they are doing, and they've got a box that is above the competition and will blow us away. It reeks of Sony arrogance circa 2005-2006. Without a doubt, there is a toxic environment out there right now concerning the next Xbox and silence never helps in these situations.

 

[Louis Cyphre]

Someone please make a thread explaining what "Always Online DRM" means, It seems many here don't get the importance of this.

Alway On and Always online DRM are two different things people.

If it's anything like Simcity, bad idea.

Sony should do another big hype event before then, reveal a little more info. Go for the jugular before Xboxs launch event.

I believe waiting so long after Sonys announcement is going to be a terrible mistake for Microsoft. Like they have so much confidence in what they are doing, and they've got a box that is above the competition and will blow us away. It reeks of Sony arrogance circa 2005-2006. Without a doubt, there is a toxic environment out there right now concerning the next Xbox and silence never helps in these situations.

I think you're getting ahead of yourself, they haven't said anything yet.

 

[Sorian]

Why exactly?

It's just odd because I'm assuming you're posting from some kind of online-connected device? A computer for example. Which has an always online-enabled connection. I struggle with understanding why, assumedly, you're OK with one device to always have an online connection and not another.

Because we bought consoles to play video games? If I have a single player video game, I should not have to be online to play it and with the way things are today, I don't want to be online to play it. I don't need ads when my dashboard boots up and I don't need BS to appear in my game while I play (Far Cry 3 for example where the challenge rocks around the island had a friends gamertag on them because he played the game before me). Let me play my damn game without bugging me. I already payed you once.

 

[BlazingDarkness]

Why exactly?

It's just odd because I'm assuming you're posting from some kind of online-connected device? A computer for example. Which has an always online-enabled connection. I struggle with understanding why, assumedly, you're OK with one device having an always online-enabled connection and not another.

Maybe he/she uses one device just to play games, and the other to use the internet. Crazy, I know.

 

[Mifune]

HE did not say THAT. That's what I'm saying. Other rumors may have said it, and I've certainly seen some that have. But he did not say that at all in his comment. Pretty much what he said was "it will work offline" but we don't actually know what that means exactly. He didn't say that if there is no connection you can't play games.

Jesus. This isn't difficult.

I think you can interpret it either way.

He says upfront that it requires an always-on Internet connection. Then says that it's following in the footsteps of say Windows Phone. Those devices that the Nextbox is
following DO work offline but their app platform does not. Now I'm not sure if he's saying that the console will feature a similar app platform OR if he's just mentioning the app platform as an example of the always-online functionality the Xbox will employ. It's awkwardly written.

 

[Hoo-doo]

I like the 4G chip rumor someone mentioned, this way you're always online even when your modem/router is out.

Go look at a map of 3G/4G coverage.

 

[GoofsterStud]

Of course they want to make anti-consumer rights practices look positive.

That's PR101

 

[SlickShoesRUCrazy]

Either he's extremely stupid and he doesn't understand what the whole internet is complaining about or he's talking about what everyone else is, which is online DRM.

Choose one.

I will go with neither since this is my interpretation of his statements.

Always on connectivity != always online drm.

^ two very different things.

Always on connectivity is the console always receiving updates, being a part of an ecosystem with your smart phone, tablet and pc, etc., versus always online drm like the sim city fiasco

To me, it sounds like he was talking about the former.

 

[FordGTGuy]

All I know is that which ever way this turns out this is going to be the largest amount of crow ever eaten, seriously crow is going to be on the endangered list after all is said and done here.

 

[WrenchNinja]

Why exactly?

It's just odd because I'm assuming you're posting from some kind of online-connected device? A computer for example. Which has an always online-enabled connection. I struggle with understanding why, assumedly, you're OK with one device to always have an online connection and not another.

My internet is spotty and I have a bandwidth cap and dont want either console to be used to download or upload stuff unnecessarily. More than one user here so I have to lay down the law.

Plus I dont have Live Gold and Im more of a single player guy. When I do play multiplayer its usually locally.

My computer is connected but doesnt have to be since its mostly work and school related. Im posting from my phone.

 

[gofreak]

The most intriguing part of C is they could do selling or buy backs (likelier)/rentals/lending in an online only environment - no guarantees they will but there's a lot of potential for it.

If its offline and offline? They can do some of it. And in an imperfect way. It would also get rid of the license migration garbage (right now my Xbox marketplace sends to a no longer operational 360, for example)

Can you not deactivate it remotely?

Remote deactivation of a permanently offline system can lead to abuse if an offline system 'keeps' games it shouldn't have, but I know other DRM systems still allow this and kind of write off those systems, and allow them to keep the games, since they know it'd be a minority that are kept offline forevermore.

The whole buyback/selling/gifting thing could be done without constant checks past the initial deactivations and activations.

 

[ultim8p00]

Your post makes absolutely no sense. If the console is always online, by default that means you have to be online to play your games.

I think this is the reason why this issue is such a clusterfuck. I don't know that an always-online console necessarily means that you can't play offline games. I think it means that the majority of the console-centric features of the console require an online connection. It just seems INCREDIBLY STUPID for microsoft to require a connection just so you can play games that you bought with your own money, so I don't think that's what they mean.

I will go with neither since this is my interpretation of his statements.

Always on connectivity != always online drm.

^ two very different things.

Always on connectivity is the console always receiving updates, being a part of an ecosystem with your smart phone, tablet and pc, etc., versus always online drm like the sim city fiasco

To me, it sounds like he was talking about the former.

ding ding ding!

 

[pot]

ps4 da best, xbox the suck.