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Microsoft Studios' creative director has some choice words about always-online

jediyoshi

jediyoshi

Member
GribbleGrunger said:
We're talking about a human being here, not something evil that deserves to be ostracised. I will NOT be part of the bandwagon that finally brings this person down; I will not sit idly by while hundreds of others wait excitedly for the guillotine to drop on someone's career. Yes, he made a mistake but who amongst us hasn't? It's time to leave him alone and let him gather what reputation he has left and salvage some dignity.
Click to expand...

How closely have you been following the thread? By this point the discussion is revolving more about the ramifications of an always online console. This would be just as much of a discussion if the catalyst were some leaked document.
 
K

K.Sabot

Member
I feel nothing for Orth at this point.

Reap what you sow, and sometimes you sow a bit more than you reaped. Such is life.

But I'm glad Karma works for someone in this world at least.
 
S

SlickShoesRUCrazy

Member
Mascot said:
Lol. I was just putting the finishing touches to a fairly long post for this thread when Windows 7 decided to shut down my laptop totally without warning to install some mandatory updates of intergalactic importance. No chance to save, no five-minute warning. It annoyed the shit out of me, but if I'd have been in the final stages of bidding in an online auction or skyping family overseas I'd have been fucking incandescent with rage. It seems my patience with Microsoft as a corporation keeps getting tested these days, and if half of these Durango rumours are true I'll be ignoring their next-gen console, Forza or no Forza.
Click to expand...

have not once had windows 7 do this to me. not once since it launched.

Always get a warning. Maybe you missed it?
 
T

Tomcat

Member
Mascot said:
Lol. I was just putting the finishing touches to a fairly long post for this thread when Windows 7 decided to shut down my laptop totally without warning to install some mandatory updates of intergalactic importance. No chance to save, no five-minute warning. It annoyed the shit out of me, but if I'd have been in the final stages of bidding in an online auction or skyping family overseas I'd have been fucking incandescent with rage. It seems my patience with Microsoft as a corporation keeps getting tested these days, and if half of these Durango rumours are true I'll be ignoring their next-gen console, Forza or no Forza.
Click to expand...

it gave you 2 days to make the update so don't blame windows but your own self
or you could change the setting to Download Updates but Let Me Choose When To Install Them
you have plenty of options
 
S

spirity

Member
test_account said:
Man, seeing the huge list of the sites who wrote an article on this, i wonder if Microsoft will rethink the decision about having always online on Xbox 720 (if the rumors are true in the first place of course). What reason could Microsoft give to the consumers that shows that always online is a good thing?
Click to expand...

Here's the thing about this. If I was to read that MSFT intended to run with always online, then they 180'd due to the negative public response, I still don't think I'd want to get a Durango. Just simply knowing that thats what they wanted to do aggravates me. I'm still ticked off about Diablo 3 and SimCity. It might be a bit corny to say this, but if I was to get a Durango I'd feel like I was letting myself down. I know, gamers are sheep, they're fickle, etc etc. Well, I'm not. And I won't allow myself to be like that. My money is essentially a vote, and I'm going to vote with it.

At least, thats how I feel right now, and I don't see that changing. I made a mistake with Diablo 3 and that was entirely on me. But I've stubbornly refused to buy SimCity even though it appeals to me. I don't wish to blow my own trumpet, but I'm proud of that.
 
GribbleGrunger

GribbleGrunger

Dreams in Digital
jediyoshi said:
How closely have you been following the thread? By this point the discussion is revolving more about the ramifications of an always online console. This would be just as much of a discussion if the catalyst were some leaked document.
Click to expand...

That may be the case at the moment -- I've not bothered browsing through the pages that emerged over night, but up to me finally hitting the sack, I began to realise how it had become more than genuine concerns and more about attacking a personality. I just feel bad for him.
 
R

radioheadrule83

Banned
SlickShoesRUCrazy said:
have not once had windows 7 do this to me. not once since it launched.

Always get a warning. Maybe you missed it?
Click to expand...
Not only do you get a warning, but if you're using chrome and reopen last used tabs once the restart is complete, everything is preserved. I had it happen to me while typing up a thread.. whole thing was still there, fine
 
M

Mascot

Member
Tomcat said:
it gave you 2 days to make the update so don't blame windows but your own self
or you could change the setting to Download Updates but Let Me Choose When To Install Them
you have plenty of options
Click to expand...

Yep, I just changed the settings so it shouldn't happen again, but NO, it did not give me two days notice or give me any visible warnings that I saw. I'm only averagely computer-savvy, but if something like this happened to my parents they wouldn't even know where to start. Anyway, sorry for the off-topic.

radioheadrule83 said:
Not only do you get a warning, but if you're using chrome and reopen last used tabs once the restart is complete, everything is preserved. I had it happen to me while typing up a thread.. whole thing was still there, fine
Click to expand...

I use Firefox - does this still work? And just to reiterate, I saw NO warnings whatsoever. One might have flashed up, but I couldn't have been looking at the screen at the time.

TLDR: fuck you, Microsoft. One more nail in the coffin.
 
educator

educator

Member
GribbleGrunger said:
If Adam DOE'S eventually lose his job over this, question the morality of feeling oddly satisfied with that outcome. I will feel shame ... I hope some of you do to.
Click to expand...

It becomes unacceptable when personal threats are being made (which is awful), but criticism and outrage within ethical guidelines are and should be fine. Adam repeatedly displayed a poor attitude with his tweets, as well as hinting about a future product by Microsoft on an open forum.

In his position, he must understand that even remotely hinting about the 720 is incredible stupid. I would also sack him if I was his employer. No company wants an employee that shows bad attitude openly and hints about a product not yet confirmed.

Nothing was done wrong here and you should not feel sorry for Adam. He showed no responsibility and now he's paying the price.
 
Y

Yagharek

Member
GribbleGrunger said:
I was part of this thread and was drawn along by it against my better judgement. I naively thought that most people were genuinely concerned with the idea of 'always online' and were genuinely insulted by Adam's comments about a particular section of America, but as this thread grew so did my doubts for its intentions.

I am still interested in the contents of those Tweets and the ramifications of what he said; however, this has now become something more. My life was made a misery at school because of vindictive bullies, so it stings when I see another person on the receiving end of something like this, regardless of whether I respect the man or not.

This has become nothing short of a witch hunt and clearly dozens of posters are now actually 'getting off' on the idea of participating in the downfall of another man. This sickens me to my core and I'm embarrassed at the fact that I trusted my fellow Gaffers.

We're talking about a human being here, not something evil that deserves to be ostracised. I will NOT be part of the bandwagon that finally brings this person down; I will not sit idly by while hundreds of others wait excitedly for the guillotine to drop on someone's career. Yes, he made a mistake but who amongst us hasn't? It's time to leave him alone and let him gather what reputation he has left and salvage some dignity.

If Adam DOE'S eventually lose his job over this, question the morality of feeling oddly satisfied with that outcome. I will feel shame ... I hope some of you do too.
Click to expand...

I understand exactly what you mean, but there are people in this thread, and I include myself, who have been very specific about who is to blame here. That is, Microsoft's XBox team, not any individual. They are all culpable.

Adam obviously made a poor choice in making the tweets, but all the blame lies with Microsoft for making the anti-consumer move to implement always online requirements in a console.

I agree wholeheartedly that the one person should not be singled out for this - it's a company decision and that is where the focus should be, not on some ill-chosen twitter comments.
 
T

Trent Strong

Banned
GribbleGrunger said:
I was part of this thread and was drawn along by it against my better judgement. I naively thought that most people were genuinely concerned with the idea of 'always online' and were genuinely insulted by Adam's comments about a particular section of America, but as this thread grew so did my doubts for its intentions.

I am still interested in the contents of those Tweets and the ramifications of what he said; however, this has now become something more. My life was made a misery at school because of vindictive bullies, so it stings when I see another person on the receiving end of something like this, regardless of whether I respect the man or not.

This has become nothing short of a witch hunt and clearly dozens of posters are now actually 'getting off' on the idea of participating in the downfall of another man. This sickens me to my core and I'm embarrassed at the fact that I trusted my fellow Gaffers.

We're talking about a human being here, not something evil that deserves to be ostracised. I will NOT be part of the bandwagon that finally brings this person down; I will not sit idly by while hundreds of others wait excitedly for the guillotine to drop on someone's career. Yes, he made a mistake but who amongst us hasn't? It's time to leave him alone and let him gather what reputation he has left and salvage some dignity.

If Adam DOE'S eventually lose his job over this, question the morality of feeling oddly satisfied with that outcome. I will feel shame ... I hope some of you do too.
Click to expand...

I bet he'll get a job that pays more than mine in less than six months.
 
D

Dennis

Banned
GribbleGrunger said:
I was part of this thread and was drawn along by it against my better judgement. I naively thought that most people were genuinely concerned with the idea of 'always online' and were genuinely insulted by Adam's comments about a particular section of America, but as this thread grew so did my doubts for its intentions.

I am still interested in the contents of those Tweets and the ramifications of what he said; however, this has now become something more. My life was made a misery at school because of vindictive bullies, so it stings when I see another person on the receiving end of something like this, regardless of whether I respect the man or not.

This has become nothing short of a witch hunt and clearly dozens of posters are now actually 'getting off' on the idea of participating in the downfall of another man. This sickens me to my core and I'm embarrassed at the fact that I trusted my fellow Gaffers.

We're talking about a human being here, not something evil that deserves to be ostracised. I will NOT be part of the bandwagon that finally brings this person down; I will not sit idly by while hundreds of others wait excitedly for the guillotine to drop on someone's career. Yes, he made a mistake but who amongst us hasn't? It's time to leave him alone and let him gather what reputation he has left and salvage some dignity.

If Adam DOE'S eventually lose his job over this, question the morality of feeling oddly satisfied with that outcome. I will feel shame ... I hope some of you do too.
Click to expand...

But "we" didn't really do anything.

The man made public tweets. Its not like GAF was wiretapping the guy.

GAF can't fire MS employees for being fools. Only MS can do that.
 
E

Epcott

Member
My goodness, this thread is almost over 9000
posts
.

A "Durango always online" google search shows this to be a hot topic in interweb land.

Congrats Shinobi!
 
R

Reiko

Banned
What I really love about this thread is SonyGAF, MSGAF, NintyGAF, and PCGAF teaming up to show their disdain for anti consumerism.
 
GribbleGrunger

GribbleGrunger

Dreams in Digital
Dennis said:
But "we" didn't really do anything.

The man made public tweets. Its not like GAF was wiretapping the guy.

GAF can't fire MS employees for being fools. Only MS can do that.
Click to expand...

We are responsible for it spreading throughout the net ... People on here KNOW how the media pick up on things posted on this forum. Many, many posters were joyous at the fact that this was the epicentre of what happened. We have to now take some responsibility even if it's just questioning our motives/intentions.

I just feel bad for the man even though I dislike what he said.
 
P

pitcairn55

Member
GribbleGrunger said:
I was part of this thread and was drawn along by it against my better judgement. I naively thought that most people were genuinely concerned with the idea of 'always online' and were genuinely insulted by Adam's comments about a particular section of America, but as this thread grew so did my doubts for its intentions.

I am still interested in the contents of those Tweets and the ramifications of what he said; however, this has now become something more. My life was made a misery at school because of vindictive bullies, so it stings when I see another person on the receiving end of something like this, regardless of whether I respect the man or not.

This has become nothing short of a witch hunt and clearly dozens of posters are now actually 'getting off' on the idea of participating in the downfall of another man. This sickens me to my core and I'm embarrassed at the fact that I trusted my fellow Gaffers.

We're talking about a human being here, not something evil that deserves to be ostracised. I will NOT be part of the bandwagon that finally brings this person down; I will not sit idly by while hundreds of others wait excitedly for the guillotine to drop on someone's career. Yes, he made a mistake but who amongst us hasn't? It's time to leave him alone and let him gather what reputation he has left and salvage some dignity.

If Adam DOE'S eventually lose his job over this, question the morality of feeling oddly satisfied with that outcome. I will feel shame ... I hope some of you do too.
Click to expand...

GAF is not responsible for Orth's employment position, Orth is. And yes, we've all made mistakes, but in his position would you have tweeted all that rubbish?
 
U

unbias

Member
GribbleGrunger said:
We are responsible for it spreading throughout the net ... People on here KNOW how the media pick up on things posted on this forum. Many, many posters were joyous at the fact that this was the epicentre of what happened. We have to now take some responsibility even if it's just questioning our motives/intentions.
Click to expand...

No, it really doesn't matter. The merits of what he tweeted + the attention it got, is what got him in the situation he is in. The motives dont really matter in regards to the effect, because nobody at MS could give 2 shits about why someone on a message board cares. All that matters is the news picked up steam and everyone saw his asshat tweets combined with the news article that spurned his snark.
 
B

BurnOutBrighter

Banned
Reiko said:
What I really love about this thread is SonyGAF, MSGAF, NintyGAF, and PCGAF teaming up to show their disdain for anti consumerism.
Click to expand...

We've had everything. Twitter drama, GAF meltdown, going viral into an internet meltdown including Reddit and IGN, GAF>Internet>GAF, DetectiveGAF at their finest to discover the ridiculous "Sweet Billy" nickname, GAF being sourced in gaming sites, meme-ification, legendary GIFs, Polygon/Gies trashing, and even the Pope himself had a little online trouble somewhere in the middle of this thread.

It really has been a hell of a ride.
 
K

Katana_Strikes

Member
BurnOutBrighter said:
No sympathy for him if he has indeed lost his job.

If I did the same thing on my Twitter account for my job, I'd be shown the door.
Click to expand...

Yep, it was a completely stupid thing to put out there. He'd have been advised on this stuff when he signed up.

I don't believe it's necessarily something he should lose his job over though. But it's a mistake he should most definitely learn from. Poor form indeed. I don't hold any sympathy for his actions. While he most certainly didnt expect the shitstorm he got from it, he should be held responsible and be aware anything he puts out there can and will bite him and his company in the ass.
 
S

Supamon

Neo Member
Amazing how things got blown up so quickly. I understand that he should have shown more restraint in what he was saying publicly but it still sucks if he loses a job over this. Morale of the story: think twice before you post anything.
 
Y

Yagharek

Member
Supamon said:
Amazing how things got blown up so quickly. I understand that he should have shown more restraint in what he was saying publicly but it still sucks if he loses a job over this. Morale of the story: think twice before you post anything.
Click to expand...

Think five times, grab some lunch, a coffee, then ask your boss before posting if it includes NDAs, potentially confidential information or might harm the perception of your employer.

Then don't post it.
 
Lord Panda

Lord Panda

The Sea is Always Right
Just sat down for a quick MP session in Chivalry ... 5 minutes in, Steam suffers an outage, MP session dies in the butt, and here I am typing this. Guess I just have to deal with it.
 
R

Reiko

Banned
Yagharek said:
Think five times, grab some lunch, a coffee, then ask your boss before posting if it includes NDAs, potentially confidential information or might harm the perception of your employer.

Then don't post it.
Click to expand...

Everybody wants to be Hideki Kamiya. Moral of the story, there can be only one.
 
C

Captain Tuttle

Member
I'd just like to thank Shinobi for keeping the OP updated, allows me to follow what's going on without sifting through all of the nonsense. Nicely done.

Regarding the guy getting fired, he did something stupid in public and paid for it. You're often told at entry level jobs that you are the face of the company, when you're at work (or wherever) people look at you as a representative of [insert corporation] and they're right. This guy did something incredibly stupid (Twitter? Really?). MS was right to fire him and I don't particularly feel bad for the guy.
 
F

fabricated backlash

Member
GribbleGrunger said:
Well I hope he does (but hopefully it doesn't come to that). He was foolish to think he could post like other twitter users, I know that, but it WAS just a bad decision, not an evil deed.
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It was a display of arrogance, contempt and poor judgement in a public place. He's fully responsible for all ramifications and backlash.

While personal attacks are poor form and threats are just downright deplorable, ultimately Orth set the level of discussion at such a low level by displaying a disgusting amount of cultural elitism and general douchebaggery (I don't really care if that word exists), so it isn't really surprising to see vitriol being repeated at him.

Furthermore, he's representing a company, he should've known better. He should've known that his elitist BS would cast a bad light at MS, and if not, he's unfit to do his job for them.
 
T

Tomcat

Member
LordPanda said:
Just sat down for a quick MP session in Chivalry ... 5 minutes in, Steam suffers an outage, MP session dies in the butt, and here I am typing this. Guess I just have to deal with it.
Click to expand...

yeah steam is offline for me too right now :(

Sorry

The Steam Store is experiencing some heavy load right now. Please try again later.






Error 503 Service Unavailable

XID: 1241437336
Click to expand...
 
R

R_thanatos

Member
Dennis said:
But "we" didn't really do anything.

The man made public tweets. Its not like GAF was wiretapping the guy.

GAF can't fire MS employees for being fools. Only MS can do that.
Click to expand...

Thanks and i agree with you .. tweets are public ..if you don't know how to limit yourself when you tweet , then don't tweet at all !

As far as i'm aware , nobody on gaf invented any information or twisted the truth , we all reacted to an information was available to everyone at the time.
 
B

BurnOutBrighter

Banned
spirity said:
I just checked, he did a follow up video that tackles it seriously.

Honest Opinion on Xbox "Always Online" requirement
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If I'm against anything, it's anti-consumeristic practices. And when these guys mess up, it doesn't matter whether or not they advertise on my channel, it doesn't matter whether or not they've given me a cheque, it doesn't matter whether or not I get free games from them. When they screw up, they're gonna hear about it here... That's my job. My position here on YouTube has pushed me into the position of consumer advocate, and not only will I do it, I will do it proudly. It's my job and I'm damn well gonna do it right.
Click to expand...

If only game journalism sites followed the same code of ethics.
 
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