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Roald Dahl Books Rewritten to Remove Language Deemed Offensive

Should this have been done?

  • No. The loonatics still have control of the asylum.

    Votes: 169 79.3%
  • Yes. I love my blue hair and will be having vegan pasta for dinner.

    Votes: 6 2.8%
  • Oompa Loompa, do-ba-dee-doo

    Votes: 38 17.8%

  • Total voters
    213

poppabk

Member
I loved the original books and don't have a problem with the language they used. But honestly I don't have a problem with the minor changes they are making either, they don't really change anything about the actual stories. The books are for kids, I honestly don't think Roald Dahl would object.
 
What is outrage culture about this is the framing as if it is a new phenomenon. Outrage sells.

Censorship in literature exists well before the current era (A Clockwork Orange, for example). Book burnings, book banning, moral crusades are nothing new. If this pisses you off, then you should have been pissed off a long time ago. If nothing else, just be glad that this type of stuff usually backfires and just amplifies the work.

The beauty of the internet is that those original versions are available to you at any time. Once his work goes into the public domain in 2060, anyone can republish as they see fit. That includes the original works. If an author doesn't want their work modified or editorialized in any way, they should note that and put it in a trust.
Who's to say we weren't pissed off by it in the past? Also, just because something has happened in the past doesn't mean people can't be angry about it in the present. There's always been rape and murder but we don't have the same dismissive attitude towards those things just because they've always gone on.
 

Maiden Voyage

Gold™ Member
Who's to say we weren't pissed off by it in the past? Also, just because something has happened in the past doesn't mean people can't be angry about it in the present. There's always been rape and murder but we don't have the same dismissive attitude towards those things just because they've always gone on.
Half the posts in this thread are acting like this is a new phenomenon. That's my complaint.

At least these days the internet helps to preserve the original work. This is basically a nothing burger compared to historical cases.
 
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Spokker

Member
Oh, and it gets worse.



Literal cultural vandalism.

Even reddit posters were speaking out against the changes which prompted the mods to remove the thread. It can still be seen by those who previously clicked on it, but it has been removed from the list of topics in that subreddit.
 
Lol. No, they aren't part of the curriculum, and therefore while useful for learning are not specifically learning tools. No kid, and nor really any parent, is going to go and dig out an older book for comparison. What may well happen though, is people refuse to read or give the newer versions to children. That will be become hard to maintain though if institutions start to get the new versions.

And what sort of adults will that create if the resources they give them are all curated so that no one is offended? Pathetic, soft ones who can't accept anything that contradicts their views.

This cultural vandalism, and it's disturbing and ridiculous that you are defending it.
Admittedly I haven't read Roald Dahl since it was required in school and wouldn't have otherwise. There was Blume, which handled this sort of thing separately at the time.

Cultural vandalism seems a bit alarmist. A person getting just as upset about things like Blood and Honey would seem just as silly, but it would be about protecting culture in general or whatever. If it was historical/scientific/social and changed facts like events happening to fictions rather than new discoveries that would be alarming. Sensitivity is necessary to encourage, not only for socializing, it helps with awareness/mindfulness.
 

Tams

Member
Even reddit posters were speaking out against the changes which prompted the mods to remove the thread. It can still be seen by those who previously clicked on it, but it has been removed from the list of topics in that subreddit.

Wow, shadow banned.

Well, I prefer not to post pay wall evasion, but here's the original The Telegraph article with the lists:

 
Half the posts in this thread are acting like this is a new phenomenon. That's my complaint.

At least these days the internet helps to preserve the original work. This is basically a nothing burger compared to historical cases.
What's fairly new is that this censorship is all in a leftwing direction. Many of the people who react to this with you're moaning about nothing would absolutely lose their minds if it was the other way round.

People act as if this is nothing important. Ok, so why do it in the first place? It clearly is important to some people otherwise they wouldn't do it. They then try to gaslight those who oppose it by saying they're making a fuss about nothing.

Look at all the white characters in films and TV who ended up being black in remakes. Or the de-sexualised female videogame characters. Now the changing of language. Lets do this in reverse and see if the "nothing burger" brigade have the same attitude.

Lets remake Roots and have Kunta Kinte played by a white saviour. Maybe Samus Aran could spend the next Metroid game bouncing around with her tits hanging out. How about we re-write Maurice by E.M. Forster and get rid of the gay characters.

We all know none of this will ever happen. Nor do I want it to. It's the hypocrisy and dishonesty that annoys me. People are clearly messing with our culture in order to push an agenda. The people who complain about it are not the ones being manipulated.
 

Maiden Voyage

Gold™ Member
What's fairly new is that this censorship is all in a leftwing direction. Many of the people who react to this with you're moaning about nothing would absolutely lose their minds if it was the other way round.

People act as if this is nothing important. Ok, so why do it in the first place? It clearly is important to some people otherwise they wouldn't do it. They then try to gaslight those who oppose it by saying they're making a fuss about nothing.

Look at all the white characters in films and TV who ended up being black in remakes. Or the de-sexualised female videogame characters. Now the changing of language. Lets do this in reverse and see if the "nothing burger" brigade have the same attitude.

Lets remake Roots and have Kunta Kinte played by a white saviour. Maybe Samus Aran could spend the next Metroid game bouncing around with her tits hanging out. How about we re-write Maurice by E.M. Forster and get rid of the gay characters.

We all know none of this will ever happen. Nor do I want it to. It's the hypocrisy and dishonesty that annoys me. People are clearly messing with our culture in order to push an agenda. The people who complain about it are not the ones being manipulated.
The left and right are both doing it. It's not one side or the other.
 

Tams

Member
Admittedly I haven't read Roald Dahl since it was required in school and wouldn't have otherwise. There was Blume, which handled this sort of thing separately at the time.

Cultural vandalism seems a bit alarmist. A person getting just as upset about things like Blood and Honey would seem just as silly, but it would be about protecting culture in general or whatever. If it was historical/scientific/social and changed facts like events happening to fictions rather than new discoveries that would be alarming. Sensitivity is necessary to encourage, not only for socializing, it helps with awareness/mindfulness.

Nah, I think 'vandalism' is a perfectly apt description of it.

If I'd meant destruction, desecration, fascism, etc.; I'd have used one of those words.
 

NeoGiffer

Member
7bmrz6.jpg
 
Bro what. Getting called fat is like "Yeah you've got some weight on you." Getting called enormous means you're fucking MASSIVE that's even worse lmao.
 

Rran

Member
Bro what. Getting called fat is like "Yeah you've got some weight on you." Getting called enormous means you're fucking MASSIVE that's even worse lmao.
To be fair, according to the change, it's actually turning the phrase "enormously fat" into simply "enormous." So they really just removed the word "fat" (I guess that's somehow worse than "enormous" though?).

That said, this is all awful modern-day book-burning. I guess history really does repeat itself.
 
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Regardless, I'm not here to debate semantics. My point is that you're being told that moral outrage of literary or artistic works is some new thing. This shit has been happening since forever.

My proposals to rectify are a solution and any artist worth their weight knows that their work can and will be modified posthumously. If they don't take the steps to remedy this during the time before public domain, they are complicit in the modifications. The truth is, most artists don't care enough and neither should you. This type of thing doesn't erase history or remove the work entirely. First editions of works are always in demand, and this is one reason.

Stop being outraged because the 'news' tells you to be. If you want to be pissed about censorship, then be pissed at every single generation, not just the current one.
I'm not outraged. I don't fall for any of the 'either side' nonsense that has infested every corner of life. I don't watch news, believe in social media posts for fly flags for any team, group or company. Please don't assume.

There is a simple solution to all censorship: "if you don't like it, don't watch, read or listen to it". The majority should never be hampered because of the minority.

In the past, the PMRC were pushed back against, the banning of CO was pushed back against and in the end those who stood for the cause made positive progress for future generations. If we just lay down and accept it now, then it will only get worse.
 

daffyduck

Member
What happened to the “this work is the product of another time and it may contain language considered offensive by today’s standards” warning? Are we just skipping that now and going straight to 1984 rewritings?
I get the impression the perpetually outraged would call that a "dog whistle" and go like this:
I Cant Hear You La La La GIF
 

Tams

Member
are they eliminating the older versions? If not, I don’t see how it’s a big deal

I think it can taken as given that they are no longer going to be selling them, so over time, yes.

Now, obviously they can't go around destroying existing copies. If they even hinted that they'd try to, now that would create a firestorm.
 

Renoir

Member
I guess the originals are going to be worth some money in the next 10 years right?
How are people going to know which is the original if there is like 4 butchered versions of Fantstic Mr. Fox?
 
Censorship in literature exists well before the current era (A Clockwork Orange, for example).
Where in that article does it say that Clockwork Orange was rewritten to remove all objectional content and rereleased in that censored state?

Also, I would love to see if libraries carry both versions, the original and censored, going forward. I am willing to bet there are some that will only have the censored version.
 

Woggleman

Member
That's not really true though, is it.

These books are clearly being edited from a left wing perspective. I can't think of a single film, book, TV show, game or song that has been censored or edited to make it more right wing for decades.
The right just tries to ban them all together. I am in no way defending this but both sides have just hit rock bottom and continue to go under it these days.
 

Mistake

Member
The right just tries to ban them all together. I am in no way defending this but both sides have just hit rock bottom and continue to go under it these days.
Ban how? They’re going after publishers? And which books? This case is the publisher itself rewriting material. Seems like a bigger deal to me. It’s not exactly a different take by another author
 

Woggleman

Member
Ban how? They’re going after publishers? And which books? This case is the publisher itself rewriting material. Seems like a bigger deal to me. It’s not exactly a different take by another author
Look at all the people trying to pull books out of school libraries because they are deemed too progressive.
 
At least banned books don’t disappear.

The clear aim of this is to slowly replace what Dahl is with something else entirely.

It’s a clear multi-decade long-term plan and vision and not understanding how to do this is why conservatives continuously lose the culture war.
 
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Tams

Member
Ban how? They’re going after publishers? And which books? This case is the publisher itself rewriting material. Seems like a bigger deal to me. It’s not exactly a different take by another author

Yeah, I'm hardly tuned into the whole thing, but I can't think of a single book that 'the right' has managed to get banned, taken off sale, or even edited to suit them.

Now, if this were about guns, prison sentences, other stuff we have to avoid here, etc. sure. But it's about media, and books in particular. The most I see is a bit of complaining and moaning. Bar the religious nutjobs that is.

No, it seems to be a very 'left' thing to want to rewrite stuff.
 

Woggleman

Member
I’ve seen some of those books. Teaching kids how guys fuck and lubing dildos. Real progressive
They literally removed a biography of baseball player Roberto Clemente from libraries because he briefly mentioned racism.
This is why we as a society won't get anywhere. Neither side can look in the mirror and see how both of them contributed to the divide and continue to radicalize each other.
 

Mistake

Member
They literally removed a biography of baseball player Roberto Clemente from libraries because he briefly mentioned racism.
This is why we as a society won't get anywhere. Neither side can look in the mirror and see how both of them contributed to the divide and continue to radicalize each other.
I know it seems arbitrary, but that was for under 3rd grade. What is wrong with them reading it when they’re old enough to comprehend such things? Kids need to be learning new languages before 6, physical development, and the basics of life. Deal with children for more than a week, and you’ll see what I mean
 
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Ionian

Member
Yeah, I'm hardly tuned into the whole thing, but I can't think of a single book that 'the right' has managed to get banned, taken off sale, or even edited to suit them.

Now, if this were about guns, prison sentences, other stuff we have to avoid here, etc. sure. But it's about media, and books in particular. The most I see is a bit of complaining and moaning. Bar the religious nutjobs that is.

No, it seems to be a very 'left' thing to want to rewrite stuff.
I wrote something you didn't like. Lol
 

SiteSeer

Member
as long as it says ‘woke edition’ on the cover somewhere and the roald dahl version says ‘original taste’ i’m fine with it.
 

Rush2112

Member
They are deliberately going through any old content and changing it for the sake of their own narrative. Star Wars, Star Trek, Scooby Doo. Pretty soon classic Westerns are going to be banned.
 

sinnergy

Member
They are deliberately going through any old content and changing it for the sake of their own narrative. Star Wars, Star Trek, Scooby Doo. Pretty soon classic Westerns are going to be banned.
My little pony, Care Bears cartoons, bye bye , GI joe, mask , all will be rewritten
 

Cyberpunkd

Member
I’m sorry, what is this mental gymnastics happening in this thread? The book is clearly altered to pander to modern sensibilities. If everything is always changed to reflect the present, how we are going to know how things were in the past and know there was a different way to do things?
The entire thing stinks of 1984.
 

Maiden Voyage

Gold™ Member
That's not really true though, is it.

These books are clearly being edited from a left wing perspective. I can't think of a single film, book, TV show, game or song that has been censored or edited to make it more right wing for decades.
Censorship is being done by both sides. What they’re censoring varies but it’s the same goal in the end. Culture warz.

Where in that article does it say that Clockwork Orange was rewritten to remove all objectional content and rereleased in that censored state?

Also, I would love to see if libraries carry both versions, the original and censored, going forward. I am willing to bet there are some that will only have the censored version.
You’re ignoring the point and arguing semantics.
 
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kruis

Exposing the sinister cartel of retailers who allow companies to pay for advertising space.
Half the posts in this thread are acting like this is a new phenomenon. That's my complaint.

At least these days the internet helps to preserve the original work. This is basically a nothing burger compared to historical cases.

In the bad old days the easily offended would take offense at the use of curse words, sexual allusions, depictions of violence and gore ... But then we got the sexual revolution of the 60ies, censorship was mostly abolished and writers could write whatever they wanted. But fifty years passed since then and somehow we wound up in a place where the easily offended get offended by just about anything that smacks of generalization and non-inclusivity.

The Witches is a creepy children's book about witches who have one major characteristic: they're bald women. But oh, no! That's offensive to women who surviced cancer, so just remove those references or soften descriptions of nasty looking women. Let's just remove anything nasty so absolutely _nobody_ could ever take offense.

70HittN.jpg
 

Maiden Voyage

Gold™ Member
In the bad old days the easily offended would take offense at the use of curse words, sexual allusions, depictions of violence and gore ... But then we got the sexual revolution of the 60ies, censorship was mostly abolished and writers could write whatever they wanted. But fifty years passed since then and somehow we wound up in a place where the easily offended get offended by just about anything that smacks of generalization and non-inclusivity.

The Witches is a creepy children's book about witches who have one major characteristic: they're bald women. But oh, no! That's offensive to women who surviced cancer, so just remove those references or soften descriptions of nasty looking women. Let's just remove anything nasty so absolutely _nobody_ could ever take offense.

70HittN.jpg
I agree. It’s not good when anyone does this but I’m not going to get upset over children’s books as a middle aged dude without kids.
 
You’re ignoring the point and arguing semantics.
It is not semantics in any way. One is "banning" (which does not and has never worked), and the other is replacing the original text via restricting access to the original and facilitating access to the modified version. Eventually, the modified version will be accepted as the truth. This happens all the time, usually for commercial purposes. How many people still alive do you think have watched the original edit of Star Wars?
 

Maiden Voyage

Gold™ Member
It is not semantics in any way. One is "banning" (which does not and has never worked), and the other is replacing the original text via restricting access to the original and facilitating access to the modified version. Eventually, the modified version will be accepted as the truth. This happens all the time, usually for commercial purposes. How many people still alive do you think have watched the original edit of Star Wars?
Yes, this is 100% commercially driven, most likely due to declining sales. Which probably has less to do with the contents of the book and more to do with increased consumption of video for young people. Intentionally creating controversy to increase sales isn’t a new tactic.

The internet wasn’t as prolific as it is now when Star Wars edits came out. The rise of smartphones and tablets has changed digital preservation. The different versions of Blade Runner didn’t make the original disappear.

The reality is that Dahl’s work will most like become entirely irrelevant and completely forgotten by the time his work goes into the public domain. If it doesn’t, the just keep a copy of the .epub and republish the unedited version when it goes public domain.
 

Smiggs

Member
This shit seems a little too on the nose. Are they doing this just to start a controversy to try and make the books relevant again?

Some of the changes wouldn't even be written by a so called "woke" person, shit seems straight up manufactured to promote culture wars.
 
Yes, this is 100% commercially driven, most likely due to declining sales. Which probably has less to do with the contents of the book and more to do with increased consumption of video for young people. Intentionally creating controversy to increase sales isn’t a new tactic.

The internet wasn’t as prolific as it is now when Star Wars edits came out. The rise of smartphones and tablets has changed digital preservation. The different versions of Blade Runner didn’t make the original disappear.

The reality is that Dahl’s work will most like become entirely irrelevant and completely forgotten by the time his work goes into the public domain. If it doesn’t, the just keep a copy of the .epub and republish the unedited version when it goes public domain.
This isn't about preservation though, this is about what the actual public has access to, which is what actually influences and shapes them. Yes, the original edit of Star Wars exists. My point is every single year millions of people watch Star Wars for the first time and it is not the original edit. They probably don't even know that there is a version other than what is on Disney+. To them, and the rest of the public for the past 20+ years, the new version IS Star Wars.

Dahl's work is not going to become irrelevant at all, it endured for this long and will continue to do so. Well let me rephrase that, HIS work will become irrelevant, but the new "updated" versions will continue on. That is the problem here - rewriting of the past.

Metal Gear Solid 2 continues to be poignant.
 
The books have never stopped being relevant. They sell millions a year.

What happened is that Netflix bought the rights to all of his work from his traitorous grandchildren and well... it's Netflix.
 
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