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NBA Offseason 2017 |OT| Only Big Ballers™ Allowed *please pay $495 to be a Big Baller

P

phanphare

Banned
Stormhammer said:
steph curry should go home to charlotte. curry/kemba 2018
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Stephen-Curry%283%29
 
C

charsace

Member
Fultz is going first and there is no question about it. He has the tools to lead the league in scoring.

Lakers are the team that has the tough choice in who to take. I think Jackson has the higher upside, probably the highest in the draft. Off the court issues is what is killing him. Ball is the safer pick I just don't think his potential is on the level of Fultz and Jackson.
 
L

LionPride

Banned
charsace said:
Fultz is going first and there is no question about it. He has the tools to lead the league in scoring.

Lakers are the team that has the tough choice in who to take. I think Jackson has the higher upside, probably the highest in the draft. Off the court issues is what is killing him. Ball is the safer pick I just don't think his potential is on the level of Fultz and Jackson.
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I honestly think Jackson is a 50/50 shot to maybe end up like Iggy

On the Nuggets
 
C

Cooter

Lacks the power of instantaneous movement
I hope PG goes to CLE and CP3 goes to SA. The story lines like these are part of what makes the NBA compelling to me.
 
Lionel Richie

Lionel Richie

Member
Tom Penny said:
Salary no matchy.
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JermHzi.jpg


Adding Smart might be controversial, but that trade is pretty much fair to everyone except obviously Cleveland. But they could get stupid in this offseason and it's the right time to strike.

Cornbread78 said:
Sounds about right, but Scals was saying a Love / PG13 trade was already in the works
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Damn that would be a great trade by Indiana and I can't wish bad things upon Larry Legend.
 
M

MushroomSamba

Member
PG13 to the Cavs would suck. He's like one of the few great players in the East that relishes matchups against LeBron. I love watching them play against each other. Putting them on the same team is so blah.
 
Cornbread78

Cornbread78

Member
MushroomSamba said:
PG13 to the Cavs would suck. He's like one of the few great players in the East that relishes matchups against LeBron. I love watching them play against each other. Putting them on the same team is so blah.
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well, welcome to your new NBA.


If Durant and Curry re-up with GS, nobody is going to bother for the next 3-5 years, so you will only see a couple "super teams" per season to try and match them...
 
M

MushroomSamba

Member
Cornbread78 said:
well, welcome to your new NBA.


If Durant and Curry re-up with GS, nobody is going to bother for the next 3-5 years, so you will only see a couple "super teams" per season to try and match them...
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I actually wouldn't mind more teams trying to follow the GS/Spurs model of drafting well, making smart signings to fill out the support roles, and then being on position to take advantage when that big FA name hits the market. To me, that's a respectable way to grow an organization/team.

I'm just bummed about PG13 news since he was about the only obstacle in LeBron's path to the finals this year. It was a pretty fun series even if it resulted in a sweep.
 
T

Tom Penny

Member
PG13 on paper sounds great but both Bosh and Love got very reduced offensive roles when they joined. How would he feel about that occurring? I think it's more likely LeBron is already setting up him and PG going to the Lakers if Clippers banana boat doesn't happen in a year.
 
S

spyder_ur

Member
Just discovered there was this offseason thread.

My bold prediction is Lonzo doesn't go #2 and I've always thought there was a good chance of that. It could all be smoke, but none of the news and reports are good, and the alternatives are all rising (Fox, Smith, Jackson). Lot of buzz about DSJ finally being healthy after his surgery and his reported 48' vertical.


charsace said:
Cavs problem is that they overpaid on a worthless player in Tristan Thompson.
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Thompson is far from worthless, and it's not like if they hadn't paid him they could've given the money to someone else.
 
F

friskykillface

Banned
Lionel Richie said:
JermHzi.jpg


Adding Smart might be controversial, but that trade is pretty much fair to everyone except obviously Cleveland. But they could get stupid in this offseason and it's the right time to strike.

Damn that would be a great trade by Indiana and I can't wish bad things upon Larry Legend.
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Cavs would be better off with Bradley to be a pest to Steph

Crowder
Smart
Bradley

For

Love

Fultz replaces Bradley/Smart
Crowder ain't shit , gets replaced by Hayward god
Love helps out Al, tries to replace playoff Amir

Ainge does it again
 
Cornbread78

Cornbread78

Member
MushroomSamba said:
I'm just bummed about PG13 news since he was about the only obstacle in LeBron's path to the finals this year. It was a pretty fun series even if it resulted in a sweep.
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Well, IND is in a bind. PG13 will not sign an extension and has probably already told them that he wants to play in LA next year, so they need to unload him this off season, or get nothing for him.

As Scalabrine laid it out, Lebron wants to go to LA next year as well, so it would allow them both to sign with one of the LA teams together.

From Pacer's standpoint, they get a really good PF that is locked up for the next 3 years and they actually get something for PG3.
The Cavs get a chance to put even more pressure on GS and another crack at a chip with Bron, Kyrie and PG13 dominating all backcourts in the East.


The year after that (2018-19) in a couple different scenerios:

- the Lakers could take on Lebron and PG13 and pair them up with Ball, Randel and Ingram to have a nice young/old roster.

- If CP3 resigns with the Clips and Griffen walks, you could see CP3, PG13 and Bron pair up.

In either scenario, Anthony will probably be released outright (buy-out deal) by that point and will be a free-agent to go anywhere he wants and will team up with them to come off the bench.




Fjordson said:
PG: Kyrie
SG: JR Smith
SF: PG13
PF: Bron
C: Tristan

At least against the Warriors.
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yeah, that's about right. Frye could play the 5 as well.
 
Lionel Richie

Lionel Richie

Member
Tom Penny said:
PG13 on paper sounds great but both Bosh and Love got very reduced offensive roles when they joined. How would he feel about that occurring? I think it's more likely LeBron is already setting up him and PG going to the Lakers if Clippers banana boat doesn't happen in a year.
Click to expand...

I don't like the trade for the Cavs. I mean, George is a 2 way player and they need that, but he doesn't fix their defense and he isn't a big offensive rebound threat like Love. If they do that they will just be trying to run with the Warriors which could work because sports tend to be random, but it's not a great strategy.
 
Cornbread78

Cornbread78

Member
Lionel Richie said:
I don't like the trade for the Cavs. I mean, George is a 2 way player and they need that, but he doesn't fix their defense and he isn't a big offensive rebound threat like Love. If they do that they will just be trying to run with the Warriors which could work because sports tend to be random, but it's not a great strategy.
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They see the Warriors as the only "threat" right now, so it makes sense from that standpoint.


Nobody in the East could come even close to touching that team..
 
B

Bread

Banned
friskykillface said:
Cavs would be better off with Bradley to be a pest to Steph

Crowder
Smart
Bradley

For

Love

Fultz replaces Bradley/Smart
Crowder ain't shit , gets replaced by Hayward god
Love helps out Al, tries to replace playoff Amir

Ainge does it again
Click to expand...
and the Celtics have a defensive backcourt of Fultz and IT, get smashed by the Wizards in the conference semi-finals.
 
L

LyleLanley

Banned
friskykillface said:
Cavs would be better off with Bradley to be a pest to Steph

Crowder
Smart
Bradley

For

Love

Fultz replaces Bradley/Smart
Crowder ain't shit , gets replaced by Hayward god
Love helps out Al, tries to replace playoff Amir

Ainge does it again
Click to expand...

Awful trade. I like Love but I don't know why you would want the C's to give up good assets for him.
 
F

FZZ

Banned
Markelle Fultz a unanimous choice for "potential superstar" in Insider's tier rankings.

Tier 1 (Potential superstars)

Lonzo Ball, PG, UCLA
Markelle Fultz, PG, Washington
Last draft we had just one player in this category: Ben Simmons. The year before that, Karl-Anthony Towns was the only player here.
This category is usually reserved for guys who are surefire All-Stars or franchise players. Only six other players since we started this column in 2009 -- Blake Griffin, John Wall, Anthony Davis, Andrew Wiggins, Joel Embiid and Jabari Parker -- have been ranked in this slot.
Fultz was unanimously nominated for tier 1 by the NBA scouts and executives I polled for this piece. Ball was more polarizing for sure, but he still got a majority of the votes for tier 1.
Three other players -- Josh Jackson, De'Aaron Fox and Jayson Tatum -- received votes for tier 1.

Tier 2 (All-Star potential)

De'Aaron Fox, PG, Fr., Kentucky
Jonathan Isaac, F, Fr., Florida State
Josh Jackson, G/F, Fr., Kansas
Lauri Markkanen, PF, Fr., Arizona
Malik Monk, G, Fr., Kentucky
Frank Ntilikina, PG, France
Dennis Smith, PG, Fr., North Carolina State
Jayson Tatum, F, Fr., Duke
This is the largest tier 2 we've ever had. This tier is reserved for players with All-Star potential. However, each player in tier 2 has a weakness that some teams believe will keep him from being a superstar.
In Fox and Jackson's case, it's the lack of a consistent jumper. Isaac needs to add strength and find a position. Markkanen and Monk are too one-dimensional right now. Smith and Tatum might be too selfish with the ball. Ntilikina isn't an elite athlete.
Fox, Jackson and Tatum all received only tier 1 and tier 2 votes. Isaac, Monk and Smith all were unanimous in tier 2. Markkanen and Ntilikina had some tier 3 votes, but the majority were tier 2. Zach Collins received a lot of votes in tier 2, but just barely missed the cut.
Having 10 players in the first two tiers is extraordinary for a draft class.

Tier 3 (NBA starters)

OG Anunoby, F, So., Indiana
Zach Collins, F/C, Fr., Gonzaga
Harry Giles, PF, Fr., Duke
Luke Kennard, G, So., Duke
Donovan Mitchell, G, So., Louisville
This is a solid tier 3, but with the exception of Zach Collins, most teams see a significant drop-off here. This tier is usually reserved for players who are projected as NBA starters in their careers.
Having 15 players in the first three tiers makes for a very strong draft. The closest we got was in 2014 when we had 12 players in the top three tiers. Of this group, Collins was the only player not to receive tier 4 votes, so the consensus breaks down at this point.
The biggest issue for scouts was ranking Anunoby and Giles. Both have had significant knee injuries. Giles is actually healed and ready to play, but teams are worried because he has had two major knee surgeries and didn't look nearly as explosive at Duke last season. Anunoby hurt his knee in January and could miss his rookie season.
Based on sheer talent, virtually every scout and front office executive had Giles as either a tier 1 or tier 2 prospect. And all but one had Anunoby as a tier 2 guy. If they get healthy, they're steals in tier 3. But their previous injuries put a cloud over their draft stock.

Tier 4 (Starters, high-level rotation players)

Jarrett Allen, C, Fr., Texas
Ike Anigbogu, C, Fr., UCLA
John Collins, PF, So., Wake Forest
Justin Patton, C, Fr., Creighton
This is a smaller tier 4 group than usual.
Teams are really all over the place on these guys. John Collins received a lot of votes for tier 3 (and none in tier 5), but the majority of teams had these players ranked in tier 4.
All three of the others -- Allen, Anigbogu and Patton -- barely made the cut into tier 4, with just over 50 percent voting them in tier 4 and the rest in tier 5. None of them received tier 3 votes.

Tier 5 (Rotation players)

Edrice Adebayo, PF, Fr., Kentucky
Tony Bradley, C, Fr., North Carolina
Terrance Ferguson, SG, Australia
Frank Jackson, G, Fr., Duke
Justin Jackson, SF, Jr., North Carolina
TJ Leaf, PF, Fr., UCLA
Anzejs Pasecniks, C, Latvia
Ivan Rabb, PF, Fr., Cal
Caleb Swanigan, PF, So. Purdue
D.J. Wilson, PF, Jr., Michigan
This next group is a bit small for a tier 5, but it's small in part because of how big the top three tiers are. This area of the draft is typically reserved for rotation players who are unlikely to start for good teams but could become solid role players off the bench.
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In this draft, that's roughly picks Nos. 20-30. A few players in this tier received tier 4 votes. They included Jackson, Leaf and Pasecniks. And a couple of players on this list received tier 6 votes, including Rabb and Swanigan.

Tier 6 (potential first-rounders)

Jordan Bell, PF, Jr., Oregon
Jonah Bolden, SF, Australia
Thomas Bryant, F/C, So. Indiana
Jawun Evans, PG, So., Oklahoma State
Josh Hart, SG, Sr., Villanova
Isaiah Hartenstein, PF, Germany
Tyler Lydon, SF, So., Syracuse
Semi Ojeleye, F, Jr., SMU
Alec Peters, F, Sr., Valpariso
Monte Morris, PG, Sr., Iowa State
Devin Robinson, SF, Jr., Florida
Derrick White, PG, Jr., Colorao
This tier has the players that at least one team told me they had ranked in their top 30. A few -- Bell, Evans, Hartenstein, Lydon and Ojeyle -- got tier 5 votes. The rest are likely second-round picks.
Like every draft system, the tier system isn't perfect, but the teams that run it have found that it improves their performance. It has allowed them to get help through the draft without overreaching. Compared to traditional top-30 lists or mock drafts, it seems like a much more precise tool of gauging which players a team should draft.
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M

MegaManTrigger

Banned
Cavs getting Melo would be a stupid move especially for Love. Melo would just double down on playing ISOball with zero contribution towards defense. Cavs need to focus on defense and system. Golden State got to where they are by playing with a system that emphasizes their strengths and playing unselfish basketball.
 
J

Jarate

Banned
LyleLanley said:
I'd say he has a higher floor than Simmons but a lower ceiling. I like KAT a lot but I have mixed feelings about "others".
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Let's look at the "top prospects{" for the last ten years (im not including times like Anthony Bennet where there was no clear #1, going to also include Embiid beccuase if not for his injury he would be a top tier prospect, or times when two top tier prospects exist)

Simmons
KAT
Wiggins
Embiid
Anthony Davis
Kyrie Irving
John Wall
Blake Griffin
Derrick Rose
Greg Oden
Kevin Durant

If I was to rerank (Im gonna ignore pre draft injuries here)

I'd take most of thjose top prospect over Fultz. Fultz I think is going to be a good 2 or 3 and is a pretty good surefire pick.
LyleLanley said:
I'd say he has a higher floor than Simmons but a lower ceiling. I like KAT a lot but I have mixed feelings about "others".
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Bread said:
Fultz is way more of a sure thing than Simmons
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Most definately, but nothing in Fultz game wows me like a few of Simmons skills.
 
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