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[Lonely1]

Isn't Level 5 self-publishing in Japan nowadays?

See it like this: Can you consider GeoW and Resistance as first party games?

 

[BishopLamont]

See it like this: Can you consider GeoW and Resistance as first party games?

Yes.

 

[Spiegel]

Its a Nintendo published title. Its first party.

No. Layton is a Level 5 IP and they have published all the games in the series in Japan.

Now that they have western offices they'll also publish games in NA and Europe.

 

[Sadist]

A lot of the announced 3DS software was outsourced work as well (like Layton) and those that are internal are mostly low cost projects like the N64 ports and that submarine game. If Nintendo haven't got a bunch of studios working on Wii 2 titles then they must have a lot of employees sitting idle.

Exactly. 2011 is going to be an interesting year.

 

[brain_stew]

That's what Microsoft did with 360, but it was a giant pain in the ass for them and probably outside of Halo games not many people even used it. Surely once you get the emulator running, you can run a lot of other titles, but it requires a huge amount of testing. Porting selected titles is a much easier solution.
.

Completely different situation. The leap in hardware will be much larger and they'll likely be getting the CPU and GPU (at least the GPU) from the exact same company. They've also had plenty of time to develop an emulator for the architecture (remember, this thing taped out back in the 90s) and I'd be utterly shocked beyond belief if they don't have an internal x86 emulator for the Wii. Software emulation will be trivial.

 

[Brazil]

See it like this: Can you consider GeoW and Resistance as first party games?

No. They are what they are. Just like Professor Layton is a third-party game, developed and published by Level-5.

 

[szaromir]

See it like this: Can you consider GeoW and Resistance as first party games?

I consider them first party. However Layton is developed for Japan first (at least it comes out a year or so earlier there) and is published over there by Level 5 itself. Nintendo is just an overseas publisher, similarly to Square Enix publishing Call of Duty in Japan (from lack of better examples )

 

[BishopLamont]

No. Layton is a Level 5 IP and they have published all the games in the series in Japan.

In this day and age, any major IP that sells well and is exclusive to one platform (and is published by that platform holder) is practically first party.

No. They are what they are. Just like Professor Layton is a third-party game, developed and published by Level-5.

Do you see any of these games making an appearance on any other platform any time soon?

You and your stealth edits. :lol

Its only stealth because my brain didn't lag long enough.

Like that. :lol

 

[Brazil]

In this day and age, any major IP that sells well and is exclusive to one platform (and is published by that platform holder) is practically first party.

You and your stealth edits. :lol

I still don't agree with you, though. First-party, second-party and third-party games are what they are. Those are concepts. There's no questioning that.

 

[Spiegel]

In this day and age, any major IP that sells well and is exclusive to one platform is practically first party.

So?

Nintendo isn't outsourcing Layton to Level 5 like brain_stew is claiming. It's a Level5 game and Nintendo only helped publishing and marketing the game in NA and Europe.

 

[brain_stew]

No. Layton is a Level 5 IP and they have published all the games in the series in Japan.

Now that they have western offices they'll also publish games in NA and Europe.

"Having western offices" is completely different to being able to publish a game in the West. Nintendo have presented Layton as a first party title in all western media and I'd be shocked beyond belief if its published by anyone but Nintendo.

 

[BishopLamont]

So?

Nintendo isn't outsourcing Layton to Level 5 like brain_stew is claiming. It's a Level5 game and Nintendo only helped publishing and marketing the game in NA and Europe.

Fair enough.

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

Ewww level up specials? Especially when you get access to the materials for 1 or 2 in every workshops? The fun of DR is using a constantly rotating bunch of weapons and balancing weapons, healing, mags and other stuff in you limited inventory, yet never being far away from new shit. DR2 is a lot more forgiving than DR1 in this regard. Food items are always around, combo material and powerful juice combos are always near the creation location, guns are better, and the spiked bat is ridiculously powerful and you can make one every time you leave the SR. Also the survivors in this game can survive plenty of hits and they shouldnt be getting hit in the first place. Waypoint them away from psychos.

God your ideas are horrendous.

His point (and I agree) is that if Capcom genuinely wants DR to be on the level of DMC or RE, the restrictive game design has to go. Making it a true sandbox is the only way to achieve those numbers.

I'm one of the (clearly many) who bought the first on 360 because of the concept and was so turned off by the frustrating design decisions that I never bothered to finish it. Played Case Zero, it was more of the same so I passed.

 

[V_Arnold]

Do you see any of these games making an appearance on any other platform any time soon?

We already have a word for that, it is called "exclusive". 3rd party exclusive.

 

[BishopLamont]

You and your stealth edits. :lol

I still don't agree with you, though. First-party, second-party and third-party games are what they are. Those are concepts. There's no questioning that.

Its all semantics, but yes Layton isn't outsourced, although its practically first party in terms of worth and exclusiveness.

 

[szaromir]

Completely different situation. The leap in hardware will be much larger and they'll likely be getting the CPU and GPU (at least the GPU) from the exact same company. They've also had plenty of time to develop an emulator for the architecture (remember, this thing taped out back in the 90s) and I'd be utterly shocked beyond belief if they don't have an internal x86 emulator for the Wii. Software emulation will be trivial.

I wonder how my current PC would handle GC/Wii emulation, my last one (with the slowest Core 2 Duo) ran Metroid Prime at fantastic 20fps at native res.:lol Though probably Nintendo could make it more efficient.
Do you think Nintendo will use IBM CPU again? Would hypothetical $299/100W 2011 console have CPU better than my old Core2Duo?

 

[Psychotext]

His point (and I agree) is that if Capcom genuinely wants DR to be on the level of DMC or RE, the restrictive game design has to go. Making it a true sandbox is the only way to achieve those numbers.

I'm one of the (clearly many) who bought the first on 360 because of the concept and was so turned off by the frustrating design decisions that I never bothered to finish it. Played Case Zero, it was more of the same so I passed.

I can honestly say I wouldn't buy DR if it was a true sandbox game. I actually love some of the aspects of the game that people seem to complain most about.

 

[hosannainexcelsis]

Its a Nintendo published title. Its first party.

Like Dragon Quest IX is first party?

 

[Sadist]

Making it a true sandbox is the only way to achieve those numbers.

Dead Rising GTA Edition

eeeewwww

 

[Mooreberg]

I wonder if Black Ops 360 first months sales will top what MW2 did (4.2 million?)

A lot of games already vacated the fall because of Black Ops. Probably going to be seeing double digit percentage decreases for number of a publishers, just like we did this month.

 

[JWong]

Somehow, I don't believe that the combination of all Fifa 11 titles of every platform makes up for less than 370k.

 

[brain_stew]

So?

Nintendo isn't outsourcing Layton to Level 5 like brain_stew is claiming. It's a Level5 game and Nintendo only helped publishing and marketing the game in NA and Europe.

Its academic anyway, if I was technically wrong then fine, I concede the point, it makes no difference. First party, outsourced, second party, third party, whatever you want to call it, its a key launch era 3DS title that is being developed by someone other than Nintendo's internal development studios. That was my only point originally, that of the numerous titles announced for 3DS launch lineup there's very little work there for Nintendo's internal studios despite there already being enough software announced to comfortably cover its first year. Those internal developers are doing something, and there's a very good chance that many are occupied with Wii2 software.


P.S. Why didn't I just say KI! :lol Is it OK to call that "outsourced"?

 

[Seda]

How does KH:BBS compare to launch month numbers for Dissidia, Crisis Core, and/or MGS Peacewalker?

 

[brain_stew]

I wonder how my current PC would handle GC/Wii emulation, my last one (with the slowest Core 2 Duo) ran Metroid Prime at fantastic 20fps at native res.:lol Though probably Nintendo could make it more efficient.
Do you think Nintendo will use IBM CPU again? Would hypothetical $299/100W 2011 console have CPU better than my old Core2Duo?

Ya think!? :lol

I think they'll use AMD's Bobcat cores (probably ~4 of them).

 

[szaromir]

I wonder if Black Ops 360 first months sales will top what MW2 did (4.2 million?)

A lot of games already vacated the fall because of Black Ops. Probably going to be seeing double digit percentage decreases for number of a publishers, just like we did this month.

I doubt it can reach MW2 numbers, the hype for that game was just insane. It will however easily outsell World at War (by being a more interesting game), which was also a huge success under normal terms.

 

[brain_stew]

His point (and I agree) is that if Capcom genuinely wants DR to be on the level of DMC or RE, the restrictive game design has to go. Making it a true sandbox is the only way to achieve those numbers.

I'm one of the (clearly many) who bought the first on 360 because of the concept and was so turned off by the frustrating design decisions that I never bothered to finish it. Played Case Zero, it was more of the same so I passed.

Fyi but the DR2 that you want to play is actually available right now. Just pick up the PC version and download some of the mods that have been popping up already. Many of them focus on removing the many structural restrictions in place in the base game.

 

[DR2K]

How does KH:BBS compare to launch month numbers for Dissidia, Crisis Core, and/or MGS Peacewalker?

Less than Crisis Core, more than Dissidia and especially more than MGS.

 

[Stoney Mason]

Fyi but the DR2 that you want to play is actually available right now. Just pick up the PC version and download some of the mods that have been popping up already. Many of them focus on removing the many structural restrictions in place in the base game.

That has nothing to do with the point he just made about sales.

 

[Road]

Somehow, I don't believe that the combination of all Fifa 11 titles of every platform makes up for less than 370k.

Why not?

Last year only the PS3 and 360 version charted inside the top 20 and those two sold between 270k and 306k. Even if those two increased because of the World Cup, it is understandable the PS2, Wii, NDS and PSP versions sold less and the overall total didn't change much.

It might even have sold way less than 370k, considering NHL 10 sold at best 326k last year.

 

[Ridley327]

How does KH:BBS compare to launch month numbers for Dissidia, Crisis Core, and/or MGS Peacewalker?

It's substantially ahead of Dissidia and Peace Walker (130k and 52k, respectively), but it's behind Crisis Core at a little over 301k. I would say that it's particularly more impressive that BBS had sold this well given how disastrous PSP software sales have been in the wake of Crisis Core and GoW:CoO, but I think everyone is expecting it to be the worst-selling mainline KH.

 

[BishopLamont]

We already have a word for that, it is called "exclusive". 3rd party exclusive.

I see a game's "partyness" in terms of its worth to the platform and its exclusiveness to it. For example all those FF's on PS1 and PS2 is basically first party since it stayed there for the whole generation. It took a massive swing in budget for it to break tradition. Like I said, its all semantics.

I'm positive I've had this same discussion before. God damn NPD and their stingy ass.

That has nothing to do with the point he just made about sales.

brain_stew
Hello friend! Have you heard the good news about Jesus PC gaming?
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Somehow, I don't believe that the combination of all Fifa 11 titles of every platform makes up for less than 370k.

Its America, not Europe.

 

[Owzers]

Dead Rising GTA Edition

eeeewwww

except the sandbox part of Dead Rising would be crazy zombie shenanigans instead of driving back and forth in traffic to missions.

 

[Lonely1]

I wonder if Black Ops 360 first months sales will top what MW2 did (4.2 million?)

A lot of games already vacated the fall because of Black Ops. Probably going to be seeing double digit percentage decreases for number of a publishers, just like we did this month.

I see it doing between WaW and MW2.

 

[Sadist]

except the sandbox part of Dead Rising would be crazy zombie shenanigans instead of driving back and forth in traffic to missions.

It wouldn't be Dead Rising anymore. Maybe in name, but nothing more. I understand that people just want to destroy zombies, but if you give players to much freedom regarding this single part of the game, it grows stale. Dead Rising isn't just about zombies: it's about survival and making choices in a short amount of time. Just like in a real zombie outbreak. I personally like this approach more.

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

That has nothing to do with the point he just made about sales.

But it is an interesting proposition, now that I own a gaming PC.

I doubt Capcom is irked over sales improving over the first, just suggesting why the series hasn't taken off.

 

[HK-47]

His point (and I agree) is that if Capcom genuinely wants DR to be on the level of DMC or RE, the restrictive game design has to go. Making it a true sandbox is the only way to achieve those numbers.

I'm one of the (clearly many) who bought the first on 360 because of the concept and was so turned off by the frustrating design decisions that I never bothered to finish it. Played Case Zero, it was more of the same so I passed.

Or maybe you just want the game your way? A lot of people also like the fact that DR has some challenge instead of just having you fight zombies? Fuck you CAN sandbox if thats what you want. But DR without the time limit and all restrictions removed on the mission would be pretty fucking boring. There is no urgency then, which all the best zombie games have.

 

[brain_stew]

That has nothing to do with the point he just made about sales.

It has everything to do with his second paragraph and the issues raised by many others as to what turned them off DR2. A "sandbox" version of DR2 does exist for those that want to play it, of course its not going to affect the games sales by any real amount, but its certainly worth making people aware of, if its something that removes the very things that was turning them away from the game.

But it is an interesting proposition, now that I own a gaming PC.

And there we go, it helped someone out and informed them about something that might interest them that is relevant to the current discussion. My post contributed to this thread, yours did nothing of the sort, so why were you complaining again?

 

[Starchasing]

Its academic anyway, if I was technically wrong then fine, I concede the point, it makes no difference. First party, outsourced, second party, third party, whatever you want to call it, its a key launch era 3DS title that is being developed by someone other than Nintendo's internal development studios. That was my only point originally, that of the numerous titles announced for 3DS launch lineup there's very little work there for Nintendo's internal studios despite there already being enough software announced to comfortably cover its first year. Those internal developers are doing something, and there's a very good chance that many are occupied with Wii2 software.


P.S. Why didn't I just say KI! :lol Is it OK to call that "outsourced"?

Wii 2 will be like 3ds .... A gimmick + better graphics than the competition + designed to court 3rd parties

 

[donny2112]

It must be awesome landing a job in Nintendo's hardware divsion. You get to take 4 year year long vacations! :lol

Actually, they're working all the time. When they decide they want to make a new console, they take what they're on and get it ready for production. I think Lonely1 was being sarcastic or something.

 

[onipex]

Wii 2 will be like 3ds .... A gimmick + better graphics more on par with the competition + designed to court 3rd parties

Fixed for what I think it will be. Nintendo will still want to keep cost down. I think if the next xbox is 3 times what the 360 is , then Nintendo would release a system that is maybe 2 times what the 360 is.

 

[brain_stew]

Actually, they're working all the time. When they decide they want to make a new console, they take what they're on and get it ready for production. I think Lonely1 was being sarcastic or something.

And you think I wasn't!? :lol

Fixed for what I think it will be. Nintendo will still want to keep cost down..

Of course they will, still don't know why that led you to change his statement, though.

They can release hardware that is cheaper to manufacture than the PS3 and still offer much better graphics performance. Cheap =/= a system that is slower than the current consoles, far from it. The reasons for this have been explained in detail over the last two pages. Surassing PS3/360 level graphics isn't difficult these days, integrated graphics solutions can manage it with little issue.

 

[yoopoo]

http://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-warns-of-kinect-shortages-playstation-move-stutters-in-the-us

In the meantime Sony seems to have had lower than expected sales of their motion controller for the Playstation 3, the Playstation Move. In the United States, estimated sales have been tallied to about around 300,000 units.

 

[brain_stew]

What's the marketing like for Move in the US? They can obviously learn a thing or two from SCEE, its not as if the US market isn't open to motion control. I suspect Kinnect may drive the 360 in the US while Move drives the PS3 in Europe.

 

[Owzers]

I'd much rather buy a new console from either microsoft/sony/nintendo than give in to the desire to rebuy a system i own in the slim model.

 

[Owzers]

http://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-warns-of-kinect-shortages-playstation-move-stutters-in-the-us

If 300k is accurate i'm not sure what to make of it. I want to see some kinect sales Xo. Both of these are incredibly expensive so i'm curious to see which can overcome the burden. Microsoft is definitely leading the hype, we'll see how well it pays off.

 

[Curufinwe]

http://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-warns-of-kinect-shortages-playstation-move-stutters-in-the-us

That article talks a lot about "expectations" without saying whose expectations those were.

 

[T-Matt]

What's the marketing like for Move in the US? They can obviously learn a thing or two from SCEE, its not as if the US market isn't open to motion control. I suspect Kinnect may drive the 360 in the US while Move drives the PS3 in Europe.

Well I've seen a ton of the Kevin Butler move commercials.

 

[gkryhewy]

http://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-warns-of-kinect-shortages-playstation-move-stutters-in-the-us

Yeesh.

 

[Road]

That article talks a lot about "expectations" without saying whose expectations those were.

Pachter's: http://ps3.ign.com/articles/112/1128312p1.html

Here is the list of retail Move games ranked by units sold in the United States by NPD:

1. EyePet
2. Sports Champions*
3. R.U.S.E.
4. Start the Party
5. Racquet Sports
6. Kung Fu Rider

*Does not include PS3 and Move bundles

 

[gerg]

Is 300,000 units bad?

What did M+ do in its first month?